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LEGO to Face New Competition? MB/Mattel

bahnstormerbahnstormer Member Posts: 180
edited June 2012 in Everything else LEGO
just read the info that MB will licence themes from Mattel and that they will take market share from Lego with it.

My guess is Mega-Brands will be history or a division of mattel within 5 years. very useful piece of market research for mattel - if the "Kits" take off, mattel dont re-new licence and start tooling up to compete in secret a year before licence ends OR buy MB out. If they dont take off, MB goes bankrupt and Mattel gets paid for not taking any risk. the ultimate win/win...


Lego's core competitor here in Germany is Playmobil. Mattel will launch a similar product later this year. Imagine Playmobil style & scale figs, vehicles etc but with cool licences, movie cartoon tie-ins - they own Hit Entertainment so Bob Builder, Thomas etc are all Mattel intellectual property. I reckon they will launch this in the US first to build momentum before going after the core market. next years toy fair is going to be interesting.
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Comments

  • ChrisJThunderChrisJThunder Member Posts: 115
    Mego-Brands gets nowhere fast. Every theme they make does not make as large of a mark as Lego themes do. HALO was somewhat popular, but not much compared to Lego. I know other adults who know absolutely nothing about Lego but still say things like "Clean up your Legos kids" when all there is in the pile is a couple of Mega-Bloks HALO figures and some LSW clone minifigs. Lego has its mark in history. Mega-Bloks? Not so much. So I'm not panicky about the market being flooded with garbage. :D
  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Administrator, Moderator Posts: 5,234
    Just a reminder that discussions on competing brands are strongly discouraged here. But as I see it, this is fine so far as it's simply a LEGO market analysis. :o)
  • bahnstormerbahnstormer Member Posts: 180
    out of interest , if its ok, why did the thread title get edited?

    whoever did it could you change it to "New MB/Mattel Tie-Up" so at least it makes sense
  • tk79tk79 Member Posts: 329
    I don't buy any MB products, but I have no problem with some healthy competition, keeps everyone "honest" and makes the market leader (TLG in this case) stay on top of their game.

    I guess the only downside would be not being able to do a licensed theme if a competitor gets the license first.
  • YpresYpres Member Posts: 200
    How have WE benefited from Lego having competition? Lego still doesn't seem to know what "competitive pricing" means. You could argue that set appeal has improved in the last while, but that's pretty speculative in relation to competition being the cause.

    I don't know how many times I've been standing in the Lego (building toys, etc) section and heard a mother tell their child they could only spend 15 dollars on a set. The child would then opt for something like a K'nex mario cart racer or something to do with HALO. It's all "LEGO" to the parents, and the kids don't really know any better. If M*** could somehow prove they don't rely on hiding their brand identity with Lego's then they'd earn a small amount of respect from me... never a dollar though.
  • tk79tk79 Member Posts: 329
    Yeah, it's hard to quantify what competition does or does not do since we can't live in a parallel universe where MB doesn't exist, but I still say healthy competition is almost always good for the consumer. Who's to say prices wouldn't be even higher without a cheaper competitor in the mix...you just don't know.
  • VenunderVenunder Member Posts: 2,655
    Having a monopoly on something is never good for the consumer. So I am happy that there are other brands competing with Lego.
    Since I'm not an elitist/purist I am happy to use other bricks, but only if they fit properly with Lego.
    Some do, some don't.
  • brickmaticbrickmatic Member Posts: 1,071
    edited June 2012
    This was announced back at the end of March. The logic behind the move makes sense. The rationale behind it sounds like something that TLG would say. It really does look like MB is making a move to capture some of the Friends market, as well as the Racers perhaps, but I don't expect a bigger impact than what we've seen from MB thus far.
  • brickmaticbrickmatic Member Posts: 1,071
    edited June 2012
    (Duplicate post deleted)
  • UKtsumiUKtsumi Member Posts: 630
    Has anyone else noticed that the friends Lego is now displayed in the girls section of TRU and Tesco, and not in the Lego aisle? Maybe Lego is trying to get into Mattels market, I don't suppose they are too happy about it either!
  • LegobrandonCPLegobrandonCP Member Posts: 1,917
    ^ Since they've come out, the stores that stock them have always put them in the girl section. I've never seen them in the LEGO aisle.
  • UKtsumiUKtsumi Member Posts: 630
    I do so hate going up and down aisles looking for stuff, usually order on line.. maybe thats why Ive only just noticed.
  • YpresYpres Member Posts: 200
    Lego decides where stores like Toys"R"Us displays the sets. Occasionally they'll have representatives from companies (like Lego, Disney, Sony, etc) who'll come into TRU and mess with the shelving and displays.

    And lets remember "Friends" isn't a market... not yet anyway. It is Lego's attempt to try and create a girl's market for the building toy section. I'm not sure whether is was successful, but MB shouldn't be trying to take something Lego might not even have (or be happy with). I'll acknowledge girls play with Lego, but is there really enough to dedicate and entire theme to, and have compitetion for too? Maybe I'm wrong, but I think these companies are over estimating girls being interested in gender specific building toys. It's just that there are already so many other girl specific toys out there that I think there's only scaps for Lego and MB to fight over.
  • brickmaticbrickmatic Member Posts: 1,071
    ^ Actually, TRU decides where to put things in its stores. The suppliers often will negotiate with the retailer to get favorable placement in the store. Representatives from the suppliers will often monitor and assist with product placement in the designated area for their products.

    When I said that MB is trying to capture some of the Friends market I meant they are trying to capture some of the sales from the consumers who buy products from the Friends line. To be perfectly clear, by capturing sales I mean that they are trying to get the parents of the girls who spend money of Friends sets to spend money on the new MB products instead. Since there is a supplier providing girl themed construction toys and there are buyers purchasing those toys, there is indeed a market for this type of product. As to the success of the effort TLG put into Friends or the value of that market segment to competitors, those are interesting questions. However, it does appear that MB thinks it's a wise move to appeal to that market segment.
  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Administrator, Moderator Posts: 5,234
    @bahnstormer - I edited the title to reflect approved scope of this discussion. It seems fine to me.
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    edited June 2012
    Some of the Playmobil figures are quite cool. They have a very large range now compared to 20/30 years ago, much like Lego, although as I like building they don't fit into Lego scale. If they made quality figures that were interesting and that were compatible with Lego and on the same scale, it would be difficult not to get some...

    To me, Friends are not Lego. They are more Playmobil style/look if not in scale.
  • VenunderVenunder Member Posts: 2,655
    Well as a male AFOL I am unable to comment on whether Lego have created a market for "girls" construction toys.
    I am buying Friends sets to make my Lego world more realistic. However there is a limit to how much pastel colouring is "realistc".

    The Friends figures don't really fit with the rest of my Lego world and I almost consider them to be less Lego-ish than figures from COBI and other clone producing companies.

  • tamamahmtamamahm Member Posts: 1,987
    Actually, I think the female market is a good place for them to try. The boy market is Lego. I think when most boys think of construction, they think of Lego. There is very strong brand recognition and loyalty. They do not think MB. With the girl market wide open, there is far greater room for MB to make a move. Girls will see toy, and not necessarily 'Lego'. For people not familiar with Lego quality (grandmas and moms buying for girls), they may not be aware of any difference with off brands. I think the Friends line, though, is far stronger than what MB is considering for girls.

    What Lego still needs to do, is to make sure they always have at least one solid gender neutral line with female characters. Monster Fighters is THE line this year that I have all of my kids showing interest in, but it is still a bit too low on female characters, which does impact my girls interest.

  • Si_UKNZSi_UKNZ Member Posts: 4,179
    Interesting topic

    @Bahnstormer, the Barbie and Hotwheels licences in the link you posted were a surprise to me, and I think those licences will hit Lego in the Friends and Racers markets, especially friends which is just getting going, so there'll be few 'entrenched' buyers.
  • DonovansDadDonovansDad Member Posts: 19
    The best thing for lego is competition, monopolys usually die a long painful death
    Barbie bloks will be tough to keep down, and I have a six year old boy who about lost his mind when he saw the skylanders bloks..... the better the other brands do,the more lego will work to tay far ahead of them
  • SherlockbonesSherlockbones Member Posts: 411
    Lego is ALWAYS going to be top, just because these brands put a well known product on the building blocks, does not mean they're going to be any better, still love Racers and I will always will
  • MagnusReignMagnusReign Member Posts: 14
    Its also interesting the MB has The Amazing Spiderman license so I guess Lego will not come out with that line but an alternate line instead?
  • andheandhe Member Posts: 3,911
    ^As mentioned before MB has the licence (from Sony I'm guessing) for the Amazing Spider-man film, whereas TLG has the licence for the Ultimate Spider-man character (from Marvel comics, cartoons etc). It's a similar case to the X-Men licence (with the films being Fox, and the TLG licence being for the current comic/cartoon versions).
  • khmellymelkhmellymel Member Posts: 1,313
    I was in TRU just the other day and couldn't find any Friends sets in the Lego aisle! I'll have to go check the girl's toy aisles... that's really annoying. Why not at least put a sign in one section that says "If you're looking for..."? They do it with the Architecture stuff.

    (although I agree that Friends Lego is a lot less Lego-ish. I plan to get Friends Lego and throw out the mini-dolls, LOL).

    I digress. Anyway, Mega Blocks has yet to impress me with any of their set designs, really, and I think that's where Lego will win out in the end. Sometimes I'm almost swayed by the cost trade off for lesser quality, but I always end up going back to Lego. Now that Lego has produced Marvel sets, (and unless something drastically changes), you can compare them to MB's current Iron Man sets, and to me Lego wins by a mile.

    Another one for the "competition" discussion though, has anyone seen the K'Nex Mario sets? Now THOSE I think are awesome, I'm dismayed they aren't Lego sets!
  • Si_UKNZSi_UKNZ Member Posts: 4,179
    edited June 2012
    linky: http://www.knex.com/mariokartwii/
    No, I hadn't seen those.
    Hard to tell what the real minifigs would look like but based on those 3d renderings they look awesome.
    Also, I didnt realise that Knex had also copied technics parts e.g. the motorbike forks and swingarms.

    And so much for competition reducing the price, those minifigs on motorbikes are 8.99 each!
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Member Posts: 10,759
    Some of the Playmobil figures are quite cool. They have a very large range now compared to 20/30 years ago, much like Lego, although as I like building they don't fit into Lego scale. If they made quality figures that were interesting and that were compatible with Lego and on the same scale, it would be difficult not to get some...

    To me, Friends are not Lego. They are more Playmobil style/look if not in scale.
    Playmobil is cool and I have fond memories of the little Happy meal Playmobil cowboy set from the 80's But there is a big inherit problem with Playmobil.. It is big, and usually cannot be dismantled,well dismantled as small as LEGO can anyway.

    LEGO at least can be disassembled and stores away in one small box.
    As for pricing of LEGO, they have the best product. Now with the way the LEGO plastic has looked recently with the big shading differences, and see through plastic, we will see what occurs with Quality, but ultimately LEGO has years of history on their side and generational buying (parents buying LEGO as opposed to other lines because they had LEGO when they were growing up, etc) and AFOLs building huge layouts, but they REALLY need to keep a close eye on Quality.
  • prevereprevere Member Posts: 2,923
    If Hasbro came out with Lego quality GI JOE and Transformer lines I think that would be very popular at start a shift in marketshare. The BTR line was terrible; and KREO Transformer line have no transformability - killing the value in my mind.
  • vwong19vwong19 Member Posts: 1,191
    I noticed that Mega Bloks will be releasing World of Warcraft sets this summer. I am not a gamer so that does not interest me, but the product seems like competition for Lego LOTR.
  • masterX244masterX244 Member Posts: 532
    LEt us hope that they make big design flaws that they will be shelf-warmers.
  • prof1515prof1515 Member Posts: 1,550
    LEt us hope that they make big design flaws that they will be shelf-warmers.
    Why? While I'm not interested in WoW (I'm equally not interested in LotR either) what difference does it make if MegaBloks is successful or not?

    The brand-fanboi attitude here sometimes is amazing and makes me question how many adults, or at least how many semi-intelligent and free-thinking adults, actually frequent these forums. It's starting to feel like the kiddie playground that is Eurobricks or the obsessive Apple fandom and that's unhealthy, immature and annoying.

  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Administrator, Moderator Posts: 5,234
    ^ I'm going to just assume you're having a bad day as you are way out of line. There is never call to personally insult anyone, especially after such a benign comment.
  • UKtsumiUKtsumi Member Posts: 630
    linky: http://www.knex.com/mariokartwii/
    No, I hadn't seen those.
    Hard to tell what the real minifigs would look like but based on those 3d renderings they look awesome.
    Also, I didnt realise that Knex had also copied technics parts e.g. the motorbike forks and swingarms.

    And so much for competition reducing the price, those minifigs on motorbikes are 8.99 each!
    I bought the Mario & Luigi figures/bikes sets for my son , they are rubbish, they dont sit properly on the bikes, and one of the legs is constantly popping off. They stand at 5- 6 bricks high . - they haven't been played with at all , even though they have been in our lounge since Christmas! The photos a little overexposed but you can get an idea of the size.
    image
  • UKtsumiUKtsumi Member Posts: 630
    .image
  • prof1515prof1515 Member Posts: 1,550
    Sorry, having a particularly bad WEEK (why I deactivated my FB account before I did more damage there). Still, the brand-bashing does get a little old. I'm not a fan of MegaBlocks either but I don't feel compelled to throw rocks at the mention of them. Lego needs competition lest they decide to get lazy and head back into the Town Junior crap that they offered a decade ago. I, for one, do not want to see the likes of this again:

    http://www.brickset.com/detail/?Set=6565-1
  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Administrator, Moderator Posts: 5,234
    ^ Like
  • masterX244masterX244 Member Posts: 532
    ^^Like, too.
  • OldfanOldfan Member Posts: 703
    ^^While it's perfectly understandable to me that a Lego fan site will naturally lead to some degree of fanboi-ism, I heartily agree with prof1515's statement about the dangers of monopoly in set design.
  • vwong19vwong19 Member Posts: 1,191
    At SDCC I saw that Kreo is coming out with blind packs of Transformers minifigs that "transform" and "combine" called Microchangers

    http://www.seibertron.com/transformers/news/kreon-microchangers-inpackage-pics-plus-how-to-identify-blind-packaged-kreons/25372/

    Unlike their introduction version, the minifigs have an alternate vehicle mode.

    Since Lego will never sell Transformers due to licensing, I think Kreo is stepping up their game in giving some competition to Lego, at least in blind packs.

    This is of interest to those who like Lego and Transformers.
  • khmellymelkhmellymel Member Posts: 1,313
    ^ I will admit, I would have been much more inclined to get the Kreo Transformers if they actually transformed. I'm not really a Transformers fan, but the awesomeness of morphable "Lego" is too much :D. As is stands, I did build a transformable Optimus Prime to give to a friend for his birthday once, but it took a bloody long time to figure out and was a pain to re-create in LDD.

    Although... now I know about things like Bricklink... hmm... may have to revisit the Optimus Prime...
  • monkey_roomonkey_roo Member Posts: 1,411
    The more choice and completion the better. Lego's competitors may not be 'up to scratch' yet but they will be at some point and that can only be good for the consumer, heck it might even spark that rare thing - a price reduction as companies fight for market share. Here's the wishful thinking.
  • nkx1nkx1 Member Posts: 719
    edited July 2012
    ^I agree, Lego will be forced to be at the top of their game the more competition there is, which is a good thing for us. Like many have mentioned, we seem to be in a golden age of Lego. Hopefully with some competition, the golden age will continue for a very long time!

    I know many here dislike Mega Bloks, but they had some pretty cool Probuilder models through 2009, some of which I've purchased. The plastic quality and clutch power of the bricks is inferior to Lego, and none of their models come anywhere close to some of Lego's flagship Technic, Creator and other models. But when I ran out of Lego models to purchase (except for some older sets for which I am unwilling to pay a premium), it was nice to have a whole other library of Probuilder models to choose from, and at a pretty cheap price despite being retired for years.
  • MorkManMorkMan Member Posts: 900
    khmellymel said:

    I was in TRU just the other day... Why not at least put a sign in one section that says "If you're looking for..."? They do it with the Architecture stuff.

    TRU has Architecture sets in the stores? Where?
  • OrangechefOrangechef Member Posts: 7
    I'm for anything that puts pressure on LEGO to lower prices. I love city but I'm stunned how much 4207 City Garage and 4429 Helicopter Rescue are.
  • ACWWGal2011ACWWGal2011 Member Posts: 534
    monkey_roo said:

    The more choice and completion the better. Lego's competitors may not be 'up to scratch' yet but they will be at some point and that can only be good for the consumer, heck it might even spark that rare thing - a price reduction as companies fight for market share. Here's the wishful thinking.

    by up to scratch, do you mean from the blind bag point(not just construction b brick bags) or the clone brand sets point of view?

    either way, i'd say they are catching up FAST. there's tons of blind bag products out there now and they often have something more to give then lego cmf's. The blinku's have the 2 rare figures, trashpacks and moshi monsters have the rares and ultra rares, gogo series 1 has the wanted and most wanted figures, angry birds(the squishy things and the dog tags) already has a potential popularity headstart as a result of the fact it's a mega popular app, and that's just a few. All lego has to offer for the "major thing" are figures that people spend major money on for army building.

    And from the sets pov, clone is proving to be a very stiff competition. Kreo has transformers(mega popular), mega blocks has halo and now hot wheels AND barbie(two things just as popular, if not MORE popular then lego), super blox quality is actually pretty close to lego quality(about the only major difference is the minifigures and chair mold), and knex has the mario kart license.
  • LegoFanTexasLegoFanTexas Member Posts: 8,404
    Orangechef said:

    I'm for anything that puts pressure on LEGO to lower prices. I love city but I'm stunned how much 4207 City Garage and 4429 Helicopter Rescue are.

    It isn't just City, the entire Summer wave of sets is 20-30% higher than the items they replace.

    TLG clearly has had a big price increase, perhaps it was just overdue, perhaps it is currency exchange rates, perhaps they just think they can get away with it.

    Who knows, but I guess we'll find out over time if it sticks or not.
  • monkeyhangermonkeyhanger Member Posts: 3,161
    I sometimes wonder whether TLG is starting to join the "bargain" mentality of other goods. Here in the UK we see more and more things with ridiculous RRPs but they're always on promotion. Things like Heinz beans are approaching £1 a can now, but they're always on 3 for 2 or better. I have seen the same with SW Lego (and probably other themes I have no interest in). For example, Tie Fighter and X-Wing, both 2012 models are generally available somewhere for £35-40 when the RRP is £50. These are iconic vehicles from SW and look to be selling well (I have 2 of each hanging up in the ceiling of the man-cave), but aren't worth £50. Jabba's Palace isn't worth £120 (I think Amazon.es got it right at 100 Euros). Am I the only one that thinks TLG is jacking up the RRP but actively encouraging the retailers to offer 10 - 25% off brand new sets so we all think we got a bargain?
  • khmellymelkhmellymel Member Posts: 1,313
    MorkMan said:

    khmellymel said:

    I was in TRU just the other day... Why not at least put a sign in one section that says "If you're looking for..."? They do it with the Architecture stuff.

    TRU has Architecture sets in the stores? Where?
    They say "ask us!", so I think it's stored away or online or something, I didn't ask, hehe.
  • VenunderVenunder Member Posts: 2,655
    I have never been a fan of Transformers for some reason. Maybe I am just a little too old. :)

    So I am happy that Lego probably will not produce any official Transformers sets. Although Lego may produce some "Transformable figures" like they did in the Bionicle and other ranges. Which might be good?
    I am equally happy that Kreo or some other company will produce these models for people who wish to buy them.
    Competition is usually good for the consumer and should keep Lego on their toes.

    Personally I am liking COBI Character Building sets more and more. The COBI bricks are almost 100% compatible, ( I haven't tested all their brick variations yet), with Lego and have some good colour shades. Their bricks are almost as good as Lego for plastic quality and clutch power. They just need a few more good sets and themes to give Lego a real race.




  • lulwutlulwut Member Posts: 417
    Off brands aren't that bad. I recently picked up the Oxford Cobra Air Force set and was pleasantly surprised with the Nighthawk in it. They just need to crank out more awesome stuff.
  • RedbullgivesuwindRedbullgivesuwind Member Posts: 2,108
    I think compition is always a good thing. I just hope lego donttake the apple route. Which is 'we make amazing products so even though stuff is cheaper. We are gonna charge the earth.' as they may be priced out esp if the other comp. raise their game as they are doing.
    chromedigi
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