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Unpopular LEGO Opinions

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  • BrickchapBrickchap AustraliaMember Posts: 541
    @Istokg I completely agree! I love making old buildings (minifig scale) but it is very hard with so little to choose from for windows and doors as you describe. Nice MOC by the way, one can clearly see the benefit of these various small types of windows, even if used in a minifig scale MOC.

    In general it is very hard making old buildings, and vehicles as well, since many of the features that make them unique, or more detailed compared to modern buildings, are so small that one cannot capture them without either a special piece, or a print/sticker on an existing piece. Windows and doors are a good example of this, both for buildings and vehicles.


    Brickfan50
  • PhoenixioPhoenixio CanadaMember Posts: 95
    edited August 23
    Didn't they introduce new window elements in Ninjago City (and Downtown Diner)?  There was this big curved piece that did a great job for a corner store.  Not quite what you want in term of small pieces, but I feel like LEGO might be experimenting a bit as well.  Personally I quite like the...  4X6 bigger ones?
    Brickchap
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 4,691
    edited August 23
    Phoenixio said:
    Didn't they introduce new window elements in Ninjago City (and Downtown Diner)?  There was this big curved piece that did a great job for a corner store.  Not quite what you want in term of small pieces, but I feel like LEGO might be experimenting a bit as well.  Personally I quite like the...  4X6 bigger ones?
    Those clear curved corner panel pieces are great, but I feel like Lego introduced them as a more generically useful thing rather than windows specifically.
    gmonkey76
  • WesterBricksWesterBricks USAMember Posts: 156
    edited August 23
    I build in Studio for several reasons:
    1) To test a building technique I'd like to try in real life, but maybe don't have the parts in quantity yet.
    2) I can't afford to own All The Parts in All The Available Colors, nor would I have storage space for them.
    3) I only use it for modular buildings, so it's nice to visualize my creation next to my other creations, or next to official sets. See number 2.

    I do force myself to only use officially available colors, and use building techniques that can be accomplished by hand and are stable enough for play & display; I feel it squeezes more creativity out of me instead of creating something outrageous that can't be built for real, or would be utterly unstable.
    560HeliportYellowcastlegmonkey76FizyxKungFuKennyiwybsveyniacSumoLego
  • pxchrispxchris Oregon, USAMember Posts: 1,624
    I wouldn't say that I don't care at all about digital builds... but they certainly pale in comparison to real life brick builds. I can be impressed with the end results of a digital build, but I agree that if it's not fleshed out so to speak, it really is just a fantasy. I love the digital tools, for what they offer, but Stud.io for me is always a means to and end to get to something physical.
    560HeliportFizyxKungFuKennyMarshallmarioAstrobricksandheSumoLegoBrickfan50
  • daewoodaewoo DFWMember Posts: 641
    I think that digital building has a purpose - to help the process of building with the actual material.  I don't think that "building" digitally, without then realizing the design in actual elements, is an accomplishment.
    MrJacksonPDelahanty
  • veyniacveyniac Northwest MinnesotaMember Posts: 288
    I can't believe what I am reading. So what you people really appreciate about a build is the monetary investment, not the creativity? I can't afford every single piece in every single color. I can't afford a good photography setup, and I suck at taking pictures anyway. I have tried to make some of my creations in real life after designing them digitally, but Bricklink orders are a pain in the a**, and I find no joy in building something twice. So are all of my creations from the last two years worthless fantasies? Were the thousands of hours of loving labor a waste of time? Listen to yourselves.
    Don't try to wow me with your skills using a mouse.

    Go say that on an art forum. I dare you.
    iwybsCasper_vd_KorfMr_Cross
  • BumblepantsBumblepants DFWMember Posts: 7,065
    veyniac said:
    I can't believe what I am reading. So what you people really appreciate about a build is the monetary investment, not the creativity? I can't afford every single piece in every single color. I can't afford a good photography setup, and I suck at taking pictures anyway. I have tried to make some of my creations in real life after designing them digitally, but Bricklink orders are a pain in the a**, and I find no joy in building something twice. So are all of my creations from the last two years worthless fantasies? Were the thousands of hours of loving labor a waste of time? Listen to yourselves.
    Don't try to wow me with your skills using a mouse.

    Go say that on an art forum. I dare you.
    I don't dislike all digital, just when it gets out of control. I saw an Instagram model of a Dune worm that was 100% dependent on curved shell pieces that clipped together horribly and it was getting lots of likes and praise. What? Lego can't even do that. Stop it.
    iwybspxchrislowleadKungFuKennyBrickchapSumoLegogmonkey76
  • daewoodaewoo DFWMember Posts: 641
    veyniac said:
    I can't believe what I am reading. So what you people really appreciate about a build is the monetary investment, not the creativity? I can't afford every single piece in every single color. I can't afford a good photography setup, and I suck at taking pictures anyway. I have tried to make some of my creations in real life after designing them digitally, but Bricklink orders are a pain in the a**, and I find no joy in building something twice. So are all of my creations from the last two years worthless fantasies? Were the thousands of hours of loving labor a waste of time? Listen to yourselves.
    Don't try to wow me with your skills using a mouse.

    Go say that on an art forum. I dare you.
    You are free to think or feel any way you want about it and that's your business, just as how I think or feel about something is mine.  I will say that I think that If you need validation from others about what you do, then maybe you are doing it for the wrong reasons.  At the end of the day, if you enjoy what you've spent your time on, then what difference does it make what I think about it?
    Chris87
  • MrJacksonMrJackson Member Posts: 445
    veyniac said:
    I can't believe what I am reading. So what you people really appreciate about a build is the monetary investment, not the creativity? I can't afford every single piece in every single color. I can't afford a good photography setup, and I suck at taking pictures anyway. I have tried to make some of my creations in real life after designing them digitally, but Bricklink orders are a pain in the a**, and I find no joy in building something twice. So are all of my creations from the last two years worthless fantasies? Were the thousands of hours of loving labor a waste of time? Listen to yourselves.
    Don't try to wow me with your skills using a mouse.

    Go say that on an art forum. I dare you.
    I didn't say anything about a monetary investment. It can be smaller stuff - doesn't have to be some humungous SHIP or 15k piece diorama. 

    And - here's another unpopular opinion - yes, the thousands of hours are a waste of time. I know because I've wasted hundred of hours the last year and a half playing a 20 year old videogame that my roomate and I played back in college. I enjoy hunting for loot and character building and our twice a week gamenights with beer, but know that all that time could be spent reading books, learning another language, going through old kids' clothes, landscaping my house, making a barn door or reskinning my shed, etc., and that those are all tangible things that I would have had I not wasted all those hours virtually - just like physical builds are tangible builds that you have to play with and show off.  I look at my Docking Bay 327 coffee table and say "Wow, I built that", NOT look at a virtual version and say, "Wow I designed that."

    And funny you mention the art forum as your last comment: you're talking to a 4th and 5th grade band teacher.  I'll let you discern the difference between a student messing around with Garage Band, versus a student actually learning to play the instruments they're recording.  You go to concerts? Want to hear a recording of the group instead of the actual group? Digital vs. real building is very much parallel. 
    pxchris
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    MrJackson said:
    ...Digital vs. real building is very much parallel. 
    Hmm...not sure.  From my point of view, the only barrier between digital vs. physical building is money.
    With LEGO, the 'talent' lies in the design.  Trial and error still happens regardless of physical or digital bricks.  Illegal connections in digital programs are the result of sloppy programming on the code writer's part, no?
    Interesting debate.


    veyniac560HeliportiwybsandhepxchrisWesterBricks
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    MrJackson said:
    ...yes, the thousands of hours are a waste of time. I know because I've wasted hundred of hours the last year and a half playing a 20 year old videogame that my roomate and I played back in college. I enjoy hunting for loot and character building and our twice a week gamenights with beer...
    huh...sounds like quality time to me!
    560HeliportandheveyniacMarshallmario
  • veyniacveyniac Northwest MinnesotaMember Posts: 288
    edited August 24
    MrJackson said:

    And funny you mention the art forum as your last comment: you're talking to a 4th and 5th grade band teacher.  I'll let you discern the difference between a student messing around with Garage Band, versus a student actually learning to play the instruments they're recording.  You go to concerts? Want to hear a recording of the group instead of the actual group? Digital vs. real building is very much parallel. 
    The concert and the recording are still the same song, no? They are the same creation, just distributed in different ways. Sure, the concert may have more musical depth that the recording cannot capture, but that is a limitation of the technology, not a shortcoming of the song. Digital vs. real building is very much parallel.
    Also, the reason I brought up the art forum is because most art nowadays is created and distributed digitally. Even professional musicians are taking programs similar Garage Band and making beautiful songs, without having to locate, hire and train an entire orchestra. Digital art programs allow creative people with less resources to express themselves meaningfully.
    560Heliportiwybs
  • MrJacksonMrJackson Member Posts: 445
    edited August 24
    veyniac said:
    The concert and the recording are still the same song, no? They are the same creation, just distributed in different ways. 
    No.
    ......This is why you go hear different ensembles perform the same piece. Different interpretations based on the ensemble and the director's vision. 

    "Even professional musicians are taking programs similar Garage Band and making beautiful songs, without having to locate, hire and train an entire orchestra."

    You've just nullified that entire orchestra's members' lifetime of practice, sacrifice, and dedication. While simultaneously in your first comment asking "Were the thousands of hours of loving labor a waste of time?"
  • pxchrispxchris Oregon, USAMember Posts: 1,624
    veyniac said:

    The concert and the recording are still the same song, no? 
    This is definitely going tangent off the original point of the discussion, but here I have to completely 100% disagree with you. In absolutely no way can you compare the two. 
  • andheandhe UKMember Posts: 3,507
    edited August 24
    I'd choose to listen to a cd over a live performance... as it means not going out my house, not being up late, not paying an extortionate amount to sit in a seat where I can still barely see anything, but appreciate that other people enjoy the total opposite!

    I've been doing a lot more digital building in the last year due to the lack of building space, being able to use parts I don't own (yet...) and to get around my terrible photography skills (I'm far more skilled with a mouse...). Some of these designs have ended up as physical builds, some haven't.

    Yes there are some dull, lifeless digital builds, and others that are designed and rendered so well you would be tricked into thinking they are 'real'. In the end it comes down to the creativity of the builder and the skills at their fingertips (digital or otherwise). I'd rather people be enjoying building with the resources available to them than worrying whether their style/theme/materials are valid or not.
    iwybsveyniacYellowcastle
  • bandit778bandit778 Docking Bay 94. Member Posts: 2,294
    The thing is, both mediums have their value regardless of what the differing opinions are towards the end result.
    I will always prefer physical builds to look at and to build but some of the designs that I've Bricklinked wouldn't have been viable without the digital version to make the instructions and I certainly wouldn't have attempted building them myself as I neither have the time or the resources to do so.

    I also know from experience, trying to remember what bricks you want when following someone else's design can sometimes go wrong, so I fully understand someone designing the digital version first and then building the finished article before spending money on it but also understand that the creative juices in the digital realm can sometimes outweigh the coin in the purse.
    Not everyone who enjoys building with Lego has the disposable income to create massive MOC's but that shouldn't stop them creating if they want to or showing it off if they are proud of what they have done.

    The same reasoning applies to the concert scenario, if you can't attend a concert for your favourite band/orchestra for whatever reason, it doesn't mean that you shouldn't enjoy the show if it becomes available on a digital format. 

    iwybsveyniacKungFuKennyAstrobricksYellowcastleAyliffepxchrisMr_Cross
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    edited August 24
    @MrJackson May I ask, are you also a professional musician alongside your teaching job?  If so, have you discovered any digital tools that enhanced or elevated your capabilities as an accomplished musician?
    The reason I ask is because I'm reading and re-reading your posts and those of @veyniac and you both make valid points, but I'm trying to figure out whether the LEGO vs. Music comparison is getting in the way of what might be the real issue: talent vs. lack of talent.
    Where Person #1 is oozing with creative ability but doesn't have a pot to pee in nor a window to throw it out of...just a second-hand laptop.  And on the other end of the spectrum, Person #2 enjoys the disposable income that affords them a finished basement lined with walls of beautifully sorted LEGO, but couldn't press two bricks together without a 3-page instruction manual.  The ideal being Person #3 that oozes with talent, and also has an arsenal of bricks to realize their design in a tangible, real life model.  I love Person #3 - because they often make INSTRUCTIONS!! =oD
    But I still consider a brilliantly designed, intricate digital model something special because of its potential to be realized in physical bricks.
    Great topic.

    bandit778iwybsveyniacYellowcastleBrickfan50
  • veyniacveyniac Northwest MinnesotaMember Posts: 288
    bandit778 said:
    The thing is, both mediums have their value regardless of what the differing opinions are towards the end result.
    This is exactly the point I am trying to make. I don't care if someone thinks physical creations are nicer to look at. That is a personal opinion, and I fully agree that MOCs usually look much more impressive IRL. But saying that digital creations are worthless, a waste of time, and don't require the same amount of creativity... that is disrespectful to, if not an attack on, the creator behind the creation. The LEGO community is supposed to be a place where we celebrate our different ways of enjoying a hobby, and I think the original post did quite the opposite.
    KungFuKennybandit778pxchris
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    veyniac said:
    ..But saying that digital creations are worthless, a waste of time, and don't require the same amount of creativity... that is disrespectful to, if not an attack on, the creator behind the creation...
    You might say that's an unpopular statement, even ;oD

    andheMarshallmarioFollowsClosely
  • MrJacksonMrJackson Member Posts: 445
    OK, maybe here's a better analogy: 

    We've all seen Bob Ross' Joy of Painting. He was amazing at what he did, captured his audience, and is timeless.

    We've also all seen This Old House with Bob Vila. Great show growing up.

    You mean to tell me there's a single person out there who thinks that Bob Ross' paintings - say, for example, of a house - is more impressive than building that house?????
    SumoLegodaewoo
  • iwybsiwybs PlutoMember Posts: 184
    That's a bad analogy, and you know it.  The skill sets of painting a picture and building a house are almost completely different.  The skill sets of designing a Lego model digitally and building one with physical parts overlap very closely.  The principal difference is funding.  Try again.  How about comparing an architect-electrician-plumber-hvac tech who makes a complete set of digital plans for a house, versus a handyman who knows all those skills and builds a house without having everything completely planned out first?
  • MrJacksonMrJackson Member Posts: 445
    iwybs said:
     How about comparing an architect-electrician-plumber-hvac tech who makes a complete set of digital plans for a house, versus a handyman who knows all those skills and builds a house without having everything completely planned out first?
    You guys are nailing it with these easily shot-down analogies: my father-in-law is a structural engineer who also happens to be very handy and would NEVER just shoot from the hip and build a house or do anything of that ilk without planning and mapping it out first. And none of my electrician/HVAC/trades friends would do anything of that ilk either.

    My god, my closest friend works for a major aerospace company - you think he's just gonna say "yea lets build the plane without wind testing cause it was fine in the computer module"?

    560Heliport
  • iwybsiwybs PlutoMember Posts: 184
    Very well, I'll stop proposing straw men if you will.
    veyniac
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 4,691
    I tend to agree with the above specified advantages of digital designs, but I still find myself a little disappointed when I look at an impressive MOC and realize it is a render. 

    Let’s try another analogy. Anyone remember the Chicago Spire? It was a building designed for Chicago’s lakefront in about 2007 by Santiago Calatrava. Unfortunately (in my opinion) it never became a reality due to the Great Recession. The only thing on the site now is a flooded hole in the ground. It still exists in the digital realm, but it will always bother me that it wasn’t built.
    KungFuKennylowleadFizyxpxchris
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Twin Cities, MN, USAMember Posts: 2,678
    edited August 25
    The title of this thread should have warned everyone that they might encounter an opinion they disagree with! Calm down. (I'm aware that, in the approximately 14,000,000,000 years since the Big Bang, telling someone to "calm down", "relax", "chill" has worked exactly zero times.)

    (Runs for cover.)
    KungFuKennylowleadAstrobricksYellowcastleMarshallmariodatsunrobbiedaewooSumoLego
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    @560Heliport Dammit you type faster
    KungFuKenny560Heliport
  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Northern VirginiaAdministrator, Moderator Posts: 5,238
    Like most folks above, I appreciate the talent and effort that’s goes into any amazing design.  Energy put into art in any form is never wasted.  My preference, though, would be for those creations realized in brick.  To commemorate Buildgate, I recommend the development of both a digital and brick strawman.
    KungFuKennylowleadbandit778560Heliportveyniacpxchrisgmonkey76
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    ^^LOL!  Buildgate.
    I read, I laugh.

    @bandit778 WHOA!  I have never seen this before...amazing.  I want this even more now.
    bandit778pxchrisYellowcastle
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Twin Cities, MN, USAMember Posts: 2,678
    lowlead said:
    @560Heliport Dammit you type faster
    Is it really typing if I only use one finger?
    SumoLegogmonkey76lowlead
  • YellowcastleYellowcastle Northern VirginiaAdministrator, Moderator Posts: 5,238
    ^ What if I mail you a letter?
    veyniacBumblepants560HeliportKungFuKennyWesterBricksbricktuaryandhegmonkey76lowlead
  • daewoodaewoo DFWMember Posts: 641
    I'd rather send a proxy to shout in the face, but that's just me.
    560HeliportKungFuKennygmonkey76lowlead
  • PhoenixioPhoenixio CanadaMember Posts: 95
    To me the issue of digital vs physical comes from digital not containing the restrictions that physical bricks have.  Beautiful design, but it collapses instantly?  Good for you for making a beautiful painting with the paint not sticking to the canvas.  It's not that the idea is bad, it's that it's not fully LEGO if you don't take all its limitations into account.  You might as well be building Megablocks there! :P

    Some games/software sometimes show where structures are fragile, maybe that needs to be incorporated into LEGO design software as well.
    Fizyxiwybspxchrisgmonkey76lowlead
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,364
    Maybe it's just me, but I never endorse or approve Ideas sets that fail to include a physical prototype.

    We build with actual bricks in a physical universe, not digital bricks in a virtual universe.

    If you want to live virtually, go play Minecraft.
    FizyxCymbelinedaewooMrJacksonpxchrisgmonkey76lowlead
  • KungFuKennyKungFuKenny Somewhere between Ice Station Odyssey and FabulandMember Posts: 2,205
    daewoo said:
    I'd rather send a proxy to shout in the face, but that's just me.
    There is a brute of a guy you can hire to bully your way through the car registration offices here. He literally just hangs out at the DMV and will cut lines and yell and stick his head through the partitions to get your paperwork done faster. It's hilarious but also terrifying.
    Is that in Dallas or Bulgaria?  Because if he is available here in Texas I might have a job for him…. :-)
    Bumblepantsgmonkey76SumoLegolowlead
  • BumblepantsBumblepants DFWMember Posts: 7,065
    edited August 26
    daewoo said:
    I'd rather send a proxy to shout in the face, but that's just me.
    There is a brute of a guy you can hire to bully your way through the car registration offices here. He literally just hangs out at the DMV and will cut lines and yell and stick his head through the partitions to get your paperwork done faster. It's hilarious but also terrifying.
    Is that in Dallas or Bulgaria?  Because if he is available here in Texas I might have a job for him…. :-)
    Bulgaria. In particular Sofia. In both Dallas and here I have chosen to do motor vehicle registration an hour or so away from the metro area with great results. Friendly people and short lines are worth the drive. Now back to your regularly scheduled Lego programming.
    560HeliportdaewooWesterBricksandheKungFuKennygmonkey76SumoLegolowlead
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,927
    lowlead said:
    MrJackson said:
    ...Digital vs. real building is very much parallel. 
    Hmm...not sure.  From my point of view, the only barrier between digital vs. physical building is money.

    There are other barriers, such as will this design actually hold together once built.

     SumoLego said:
    Maybe it's just me, but I never endorse or approve Ideas sets that fail to include a physical prototype.

    I'm the same on IDEAS but for a different reason. If the creator doesn't believe in their design enough to purchase the bricks to build it, then why would anyone else want to pay to build it?
    SumoLegodatsunrobbielowleadgmonkey76Marshallmario
  • andheandhe UKMember Posts: 3,507
    On the subject of physical vs digital (sort of).

    My possibly unpopular opinion is that giant brick-built sculptures are dull.
    Such as the work of Nathan Sawaya and those life-size models of Iron Man etc made out of lego bricks that you seen at the lego store, conventions etc.

    I can appreciate the amount of hours put in to actually build it, but I'm just assuming you just bang it all into a computer program and it tells you what bricks to put where (stud.io has a similar function, but I've not actually used it).

    If someone has proof of an intricate design process beyond that then I'll be pleased to see it, and it might give me more appreciation for the works!

    lowleadAyliffeiwybs
  • lowleadlowlead USAMember Posts: 251
    CCC said:
    There are other barriers, such as will this design actually hold together once built.
    Are you referring to glitches in the digital program that allow illegal connections, or tenuous and overly-delicate designs?  A physical build does not necessarily mean it's a robust one, regardless of the source of its design.
    There are plenty of physical MOCs that look wonderful in a photograph, but disintegrate if you dare pick it up.  I have encountered this occasional pitfall when building other creators' designs - it warrants careful study and/or modification. 
    iwybsgmonkey76Brickchapandhe
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