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LEGO's 90th Anniversary Theme: Hopes and Speculations

135

Comments

  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 20,317
    ... which brings us back to - why not have multiple sets to celebrate the anniversary for different themes. Still, if they think 90th isn’t quite significant enough to merit a mini range of one off sets, wait 10 years and they’ll have to do something significant for the 100th.

    I think this. 90th isn't that big a deal to do a lot of sets, when 100th is not that far off.


    It’s likely still exacerbated too by TLG’s recent focus on themes like Ninjago and away from their core themes like Space, Pirates and Castle (I’m sure with market research that to some degree backs up this decision). Particularly adult fans are desperate to get something from one of the themes that feels like it’s been neglected or forgotten in recent years. Bionicle isn’t in a good position in those terms compared to some of TLG’s (previously so called) ‘evergreen’ themes because it did have a full on revival theme-wise that just didn’t do very well.
    In the future, looking back, Ninjago will the THE (in-house) theme of the 2010s decade. And Bionicle is probably the theme of the 2000s decade. Those themes are just as important to their children of the era as Classic Space/Castle/Pirates was for that age group.

    Bionicle may have had a not so great revival after a decade or so, but then so did some Castle, Pirates, Technic and other sets after a decade or so and they didn't do so well either.


    AyliffestluxMinifigInSpaceFizyxandheAanchirgmonkey76Redbullgivesuwindcatwrangler
  • MinifigInSpaceMinifigInSpace USAMember Posts: 134
    All I want is a LEGO system-based fantasy theme  :)
  • bricktuarybricktuary Krakozhia (temporarily stuck in London)Member Posts: 947
    Not an Elves fan then?
    MinifigInSpace
  • The_RancorThe_Rancor Dorset, UKMember Posts: 2,334
    edited January 2021
    Not an Elves fan then?
    Well, unfortunately it was taken away from us by TLG, I assume in favour of just having Friends and Disney Princesses as the only minidoll themes.

    My theme highlights of the noughties moved on quickly - I was a big Bionicle fan in the first few years, but then moved on to Knights Kingdom, Exo-Force and then of course Fantasy Castle (somewhat competing with my love of Clone Wars). However I acknowledge the fandom of Bionicle endures even when they moved into unusual minifigure hybrid sets around the Hordika era I think.
    MinifigInSpaceBumblepants
  • MinifigInSpaceMinifigInSpace USAMember Posts: 134
    Not an Elves fan then?
    Nah, not really.

    By system-based fantasy I was thinking more of Adventurers Castle, Space, Pirates, etc. Perhaps "fictional" would have been a better word.
    Brickchap
  • MinifigInSpaceMinifigInSpace USAMember Posts: 134
    Fizyx said:

    So what I'm hearing is that the set we need here is a giant Bionicle attacking a yellow castle along with some pirates as the forestmen and black falcons defend it, all in the middle of a classic town setup, while a fleet of spaceships in various livery (blue/yellow/gray, red/black,blue/white/neon orange) fight amongst themselves above?  All surrounded by a monorail?

    I can get behind that.
    Don't forget the pond of Aquasharks!
    560HeliportFizyxBrickchapgmonkey76catwrangler
  • karritkarrit USAMember Posts: 651
    edited January 2021
    And the Tombs, Treasures beyond imagine, Dinosaurs and all from Adventurers.  And while we're at it perhaps a lovely Stockade Fort surrounded by a few TeePees with a few of those new Tan Horses. 
    MinifigInSpace560HeliportFizyxBrickchapgmonkey76catwrangler
  • The_RancorThe_Rancor Dorset, UKMember Posts: 2,334
    ... guarded by an army of Slizers - naturally ;)
    MinifigInSpaceKungFuKenny560HeliportFizyxgmonkey76catwrangler
  • andheandhe UKMember Posts: 3,710
    I think the biggest issue people might have with Bionicle is it's not system based. The minfig and minfig scale sets have been TLG's bread and butter for so long, it would feel strange to celebrate 90 years with a celebration of anything else other than a minfig based theme (even if the final set ends up microscale etc).
    MinifigInSpaceKungFuKenny560HeliportFizyxBrickchapNateMN2020gmonkey76Mr_Crosscatwrangler
  • BrickchapBrickchap AustraliaMember Posts: 827
    @andhe Precisely. For 90 years of Lego it should be recognisably Lego. It doesnt matter that Bioncile is technically Lego or that it has a large fan base (so does a lot of other themes...). If you stop a random civilian in the street and ask them to describe Lego they will describe System bricks, and maybe minfigs or 'Lego people'.

    I also believe calls for the Classic themes have been far more popular then Bionicle, like lets suppose Bionicile was not included on the list, would there really have been much backlash? I doubt it.

    Its a shame Imperials isnt higher, as perhaps Lego could have sort of combined Pirates and Castle as in do a more 17th century fort perhaps so basically just a castle which could be easily modified for Castle fans and then a naval ship to fight the Black Seas Barracuda. By the way, what was the name of the famous Imperial fort set? I forget. I keep getting it mixed up with Fort Legorado thinking it was Legorado Fortress or something.

    If they did Adventurers, it could maybe include a train....

    If classic space were chosen I wonder if they would do a monorail using the new rollercoaster tracks. That would be pretty darn popular.
    560HeliportMinifigInSpacecatwrangler
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Twin Cities, MN, USAMember Posts: 3,083
    @Brickchap #6276 Eldorado Fortress. 
    MinifigInSpaceBrickchapKungFuKennygmonkey76
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Twin Cities, MN, USAMember Posts: 3,083
    edited January 2021
    I'd love to see #6276 and #6277 combined as the 90th anniversary set! Hey, @pxchris what do you think?
    MinifigInSpacegmonkey76pxchris
  • BrickchapBrickchap AustraliaMember Posts: 827

    Thats what I was thinking, its such a shame lego split Pirates and Imperials.

    I have always wanted naval stuff (I prefer the navy to the pirates, pirates are after all just criminals and the imperial uniforms look cooler).

    Maybe a pirate fort being attacked by a naval ship? Surely Lego would have to do something substantial for the Imperials given that we've already got POBB (and that creator ship) while the last adversary we had for the pirates was Imperial Flag Ship.

    After all, when ye a pirate ya gotta have ships fulla doubloons to rob and the blastard Royal Navy to fight right?

    Perhaps an Imperial Trading Post set could be done, just as 560Heliport suggests with a combined fortress but have it as a 'civilian' port being raided by pirates rather then specifically a 'Imperial' port, that way they could give us some good naval stuff (and a MUCH NEEDED merchant ship) while still acknowledging the vote for 'Pirates' over 'Imperials'

    Would that work? Sort of Imperial Trading Post-The London Escape-Medieval Market Village-Eldorado Fortress sort of a thing. Have a couple of regular buildings the size of the original imperial trading post, at most the size of say the WV Post Office and Train Station, a decent sized fort, a dock and merchant ship. The pirates could row ashore from the unincluded-in-the-set Black Seas Barracuda, could a small pirate chaser be included? Perhaps around the size of the Creator Pirate ship?
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,979
    edited January 2021
    Brickchap said:
    @andhe Precisely. For 90 years of Lego it should be recognisably Lego. It doesnt matter that Bioncile is technically Lego or that it has a large fan base (so does a lot of other themes...). If you stop a random civilian in the street and ask them to describe Lego they will describe System bricks, and maybe minfigs or 'Lego people'.

    I also believe calls for the Classic themes have been far more popular then Bionicle, like lets suppose Bionicile was not included on the list, would there really have been much backlash? I doubt it.
    There'd have certainly been plenty of backlash from Bionicle fans, even if compared to System fans they don't tend to overlap as heavily with the sites and communities that you tend to frequent.
    Trust me when I say that Bionicle fans can create quite an unpleasant uproar when stuff drawing on a wide swath of the LEGO brand (like the LEGO Movie, LEGO Universe, LEGO Dimensions, LEGO Legacy: Heroes Unboxed, etc) fails to give Bionicle more than a passing mention. Even within the past month, I've seen that sort of bitterness about LEGO celebrating the 10th anniversary of Ninjago and not the 20th anniversary of Bionicle, even if it aligns with LEGO's general tendency to focus more on the anniversaries of ongoing product lines than of discontinued ones.
    LEGO has previously celebrated the company's history with brick-built recreations of other non-System toys like the classic wooden duck, and I don't remember AFOLs being nearly as bothered by that. As such, I feel like there's deeper roots to the current "backlash" against Bionicle than just whether the original sets used traditional bricks or minifigures.
    And LEGO has plenty of other opportunities to pay homage to traditional bricks and minifigures — after all, the 80th anniversary of the brick and 40th anniversary of the minifigure were just three years ago! Heck, just within the past year, we've seen premium, AFOL-targeted Ideas sets celebrating classic themes like Castle and Pirates.
    So is it really unreasonable for fans of Bionicle, like fans of Castle or Space or Pirates, to hope for a shred of recognition in a year when LEGO celebrates the entirety of their history (even the non-brick-based parts of it)? I'm not saying Bionicle fans deserve this any more than anybody else, but it feels unfair to act like LEGO would have been wiser to deny them that chance entirely, just to placate other AFOLs who expect System themes to get special privilege.
    AyliffestluxRedbullgivesuwindcatwrangler
  • BrickBeltBrickBelt United StatesMember Posts: 29
    edited January 2021
    andhe said:
    I think the biggest issue people might have with Bionicle is it's not system based. The minfig and minfig scale sets have been TLG's bread and butter for so long, it would feel strange to celebrate 90 years with a celebration of anything else other than a minfig based theme (even if the final set ends up microscale etc).
    A lot of Bionicle fan MoCs are much more technical and incorporate more system parts than the official sets. An anniversary theme would be a nice opportunity to make something that's more in line with those. "Toa Mata MoC" on Google brings up plenty of interesting ideas. Here's one I like:



    All six toa like that plus something for them to fight would be a good set. 
    stluxcatwrangler
  • BrickchapBrickchap AustraliaMember Posts: 827
    Just on a classic castle (when I say classic castle I just mean a pre 2000s era medieval set). While I love castles, my main concern (and reason I would likely lean more towards pirates) is that Lego castle sets never have enough attackers or defenders and at most one siege engine. In my case, I own the Kingdoms King's Castle which included four attacking knights I believe and NO siege engines! Thankfully I have one catapult from another set but thats it.

    If Lego does a medieval theme for the 90 years anniversary, (Im assuming theyd do a 'big' castle) then it would need to include at least one catapult and/or trebuchet and a battering ram. A siege tower or siege ladders or more creative ideas such as those huts on wheels used to protect workers digging under a wall would all be welcome inclusions.

    There would need to be a lot of minifigs included, Id hope at least 13 (I say 13 as it would be 6 knights each side and a King for the castle otherwise the castle owners would only have 5 defenders) and Id want to see some significant play features.

    Specifically, Lego has never really done a castle that can truly be attacked or at least in my lifetime anyway.

    Id want to see a battering ram included with the ability to 'knock down' the castle gates, 'blow up' sections of the castle walls using a catapult, a sort of supersized version of what they do with fire and stud shooters in City. Hopefully people will know what Im talking about when I refer to the 2015 City Demolition Site set, similar ideas to that for breaking apart the castle walls. 
    BrickBeltcatwrangler
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 20,317
    Brickchap said:
    Perhaps an Imperial Trading Post set could be done, just as 560Heliport suggests with a combined fortress but have it as a 'civilian' port being raided by pirates rather then specifically a 'Imperial' port, that way they could give us some good naval stuff (and a MUCH NEEDED merchant ship) while still acknowledging the vote for 'Pirates' over 'Imperials' 

    Would that work? Sort of Imperial Trading Post-The London Escape-Medieval Market Village-Eldorado Fortress sort of a thing. Have a couple of regular buildings the size of the original imperial trading post, at most the size of say the WV Post Office and Train Station, a decent sized fort, a dock and merchant ship. The pirates could row ashore from the unincluded-in-the-set Black Seas Barracuda, could a small pirate chaser be included? Perhaps around the size of the Creator Pirate ship?
    Would it work? Yes, for the small minority of fans that are into Pirates/Imperials.

    But such an idea no more represents LEGO'S history than Bionicle or anything else. I don't think I'd want such a set as an anniversary set either. That sort of idea sounds like a normal retail set and if LEGO thinks it will sell then it should be released as a regular retail set.
    stluxAyliffepxchris
  • Speedman29Speedman29 UKMember Posts: 2,125
    Ayliffe said:
    I usually hate to jump on the "both sides are as bad as eachother!" train, but after seeing the response to this poll both on here and elsewhere online that's the feeling I'm getting from the Bionicle/Classic themes debate. On one side you've got folks arguing that Bionicle "isn't a real theme" and "doesn't deserve a place on the poll", whilst on the other end of the scale you've got Bionicle fans treating the other themes like dirt and beliving Bionicle to be the only "worthy" choice. Every option on this poll is a valid one and trying to act high-and-mighty by punching down at others isn't gonna help matters, no matter what you're rooting for - be excellent to eachother an' all that.
    I have to agree. A lot of the themes in the list are just not on my radar, coming out when I was either in my dark ages or something that just doesn't interest me at all, but who knows, if one of those wins and gets a cool set then I may be intrigued enough to buy it. 
    Its quite sad when people are so blinkered by their own favourite they have to belittle others to validate themselves. 




    gmonkey76Ayliffe560HeliportBrickBeltMr_Cross
  • pxchrispxchris Oregon, USAMember Posts: 1,929
    I'd love to see #6276 and #6277 combined as the 90th anniversary set! Hey, @pxchris what do you think?
    I would love to see an imperial fortress along these lines! Perhaps it would be better suited in the Ideas arena (there are some projects exactly along these lines in there now) than to represent the 90 years of LEGO though, as some folks made excellent points about. It will certainly be interesting to see how all of this pans out in the end.

    Not that it really matters since we all know that only Fabuland could truly represent LEGO in such a prestigious affair.
    KungFuKenny560HeliportMinifigInSpaceMarshallmariocatwranglersklamb
  • JMasterJMaster USAMember Posts: 17
    Sorry, I had to make this.


    AyliffeBumblepants
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,979
    Mr_Cross said:
    Whatever does win, I'd like the eventual set to use modern techniques and new pieces to fit with the established aesthetics, not religiously, I'm cool with variation. Making something new is probably the only way to truly celebrate "LEGO" and really doing that to any of these themes will upset some people, epecially those that voted for that theme.

    I say this as a someone who loves and collects LEGO, as an adult, and as a fan, even though I don't own any Bionicle and never really "got" it, if it wins, great, and if the set that is resultant from this is cool, I'll buy it.
    Probably, if there isn't something else I prefer ;-)
    This is one set amongst hundreds LEGO will release in the next couple of years, I'm fairly sure I'll like something.

    I'll be a bit disappointed for a minute or two if there isn't a new "Classic Space" set on the horizon, but I think I'll survive that.
    Yeah, this is pretty much my perspective also. I mean, I was plenty excited for the classic theme throwbacks in sets like Benny's Spaceship, Barracuda Bay, and the Blacksmith Shop, even if the Classic Space, Black Seas Barracuda, and Black Falcons sets were all "before my time".

    I'll most likely be voting for Bionicle in the next round, but I probably won't be too sore if it doesn't end up winning. Honestly, the fact that it even made it to round 2 is kind of impressive to me. It certainly helps to give me hope that a Bionicle tribute set of some kind might be possible at SOME point even if it doesn't emerge victorious in this particular contest/poll.
    Mr_CrossAyliffeiwybscatwranglersklamb
  • 12651265 The Great State of TexasMember Posts: 1,092
    The only way Bionicle wins if Dominion Voting Systems is in charge of the results. :)
    MinifigInSpacebricktuarygmonkey76
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 20,317
    Mr_Cross said:

    This is one set amongst hundreds LEGO will release in the next couple of years, I'm fairly sure I'll like something.

    I agree that most fans will find something on the shelves that they like as in any other year. But what is the point of an anniversary set? If it is going to be just another regular set among 100s, that are only really of interest to a specific fan group, why bother with the anniversary branding?
    560HeliportBrickchap
  • Mr_CrossMr_Cross East Anglia (UK)Member Posts: 1,621
    CCC said:
    Mr_Cross said:

    This is one set amongst hundreds LEGO will release in the next couple of years, I'm fairly sure I'll like something.

    I agree that most fans will find something on the shelves that they like as in any other year. But what is the point of an anniversary set? If it is going to be just another regular set among 100s, that are only really of interest to a specific fan group, why bother with the anniversary branding?
    I'd cynically suggest that this is just a branding exercise anyway.
    560Heliport
  • catwranglercatwrangler Northern IrelandMember Posts: 1,894
    edited January 2021
    I picked Forestmen, Wolf Pack and M-Tron, but I have no illusions about any of them winning. I'm actually impressed Forestmen are in the top ten at all. I think the theory that it's a bit of stealthy market research holds up - otherwise I don't see why they'd split up protagonists and antagonists (e.g. Pirates vs. Imperials) who you'd expect to find together in any large set of their general theme anyway.

    It suggests they're not really trying to define the most beloved theme so much as the most beloved aesthetic - look at how differently styled the various space subthemes are, for instance. Also, perhaps the reason they're doing this for the 90th anniversary is so they can use the insights when the 100th rolls round. 

    I can afford to be chill about the outcome because Ideas alone is giving me the "nostalgic but ambitious" feel I want with sets like POBB and the new Blacksmith (I may be about to fall off the "not collecting" wagon, ho-hum).
    KungFuKennyMinifigInSpacegmonkey76andhe
  • MinifigInSpaceMinifigInSpace USAMember Posts: 134
    Stonewars has updated the count, and so far the positions have not changed. https://www.stonewars.de/news/lego-ideas-umfrage-zwischenstand/

    I voted a few days before the vote closed, but my vote is still in drafts waiting to be "reviewed." I am beginning to think LEGO may have capped their transparency in votes (especially since the 50k number didn't change for a few days). So there's still some unknown data, and even though this isn't the final count, I can't image the first or second positions changing too much. 
    catwrangler
  • FizyxFizyx ColoradoMember Posts: 1,232
    It suggests they're not really trying to define the most beloved theme so much as the most beloved aesthetic - look at how differently styled the various space subthemes are, for instance.

    That is actually a super insightful thought.  I hadn't thought of it that way, at least, and it really does make the way they split the themes up make much more sense. 

    catwranglerAanchir
  • catwranglercatwrangler Northern IrelandMember Posts: 1,894
    I think a clue to their intentions is in the fact they haven't promised to run/be transparent with the popular vote by the final stage. As a number of you have pointed out, it might actually be a bit of a nuisance for them if Bionicle won, unless of course they're planning on bringing the theme back wholesale and have made new moulds.

    But what they gain from including it as an option - and particularly, from allowing people at this stage to vote for three different things, is that they can identify what else people who like Bionicle (or any other theme/subtheme) also like. That might be the most valuable aspect of the data for them, and something not so easily extrapolated from other trends, like Ideas voting patterns.

    One really noticeable trend in their in-house themes recently has been genre mashups. As derided as Nexo Knights was among AFOLs, pairing an aesthetic that nods at Ice Planet with Castle concepts was a bold choice, and presumably one they didn't make by throwing a dart at a board blindfolded. It ran for three years. And of course Ninjago is a staggeringly successful mashup of science fiction, fantasy and even modern city aesthetics. With Monkey Kid, there's a similar kind of fusion going on: Chinese mythology plus mechs. Even Hidden Side - it's a slightly retro American tinged city theme, but with monsters (always a draw). 

    Of course, just because I vote for Forestmen + M-Tron, it doesn't necessarily follow that what I want is Robin Hood in neon green instead of Lincoln green, robbing from the galactic rich to give to the poor beyond the rim. Some of us let our eight-year-old selves vote, and those eight-year-olds are cherry-picking themes we loved then, or wish we'd owned more of/at all. But it'd be interesting to know how peoples' votes cluster, and if it's always obviously generational nostalgia (i.e. people like me, picking subthemes from a relatively narrow period), or if there's a whole tranche of people who love Classic Space, but also Elves, say...
    MinifigInSpace560HeliportKungFuKennyBumblepantsMr_Crossgmonkey76andhepxchrissklamb
  • The_RancorThe_Rancor Dorset, UKMember Posts: 2,334
    Indeed, splitting out all the castle and space themes makes little sense when it comes to just generally finding out whether Castle is more popular than Trains, Pirates etc. But it does tell TLG what ‘kind’ of interpretation is more popular within a given theme. One would hope that a future interpretation of a castle line might lean towards the ‘Robin Hood’ style of Forestmen, and a future space line could be a ‘Space Police 4’ based on the votes (assuming we ever get a non-IP Space line again).

    The intriguing thing is the popularity of Adventurers even though it’s not in the top 3. Does it mean TLG will include an Indiana Jones inspired aesthetic with a future theme and globe trotting nature? Perhaps not, though it would be nice to get a separate one off 18+ set relating to Adventurers - I feel the nods in the haunted house weren’t really sufficient for fans - fundamentally you needed to want a haunted house to buy the set, not only an interest in Adventurers. I think it’s safe to assume TLG can give a bit more focus on trains and more 18+ Trains to go with the crocodile, given their popularity.
    560HeliportMinifigInSpaceKungFuKennygmonkey76andheAanchircatwrangler
  • MaffyDMaffyD West YorkshireMember Posts: 3,242
    I've got to say, I feel bad for all the 'Exclusively Bionicle' fans out there. It's obvious that this will be one of the top three, as it's first right now, by a long long way. I can't remember what happens after the top three are released, but can I have view on the options here?
    1. Bionicle wins, and TLG produce a new Bionicle set. How do they do this?  Resurrected moulds or brand new ones, some kind of technic/system hybrid or a 'recreated in bricks' homage display set (like the wooden duck).
    2. Bionicle doesn't win, because of the cost implications, logistical challenges, design issues or perceived consumer reaction to any of the options outlined in 1. above, and Lego alienate a massive bunch of people.
    3. Something else?
    For me, obviously I have a desire for a set from a particular theme. If I don't get one, I will probably not buy the set they do make, but I'm ok with that - there's plenty of other stuff I can buy.
    But for those fans of Bionicle who want that more than anything else, like, by a lot - they have nothing else that fills that void for them. There's got to be a better result than that, hasn't there?
    I'd appreciate counter-arguments to this - I'm sure I'm missing things or assuming things.
    andhecatwrangler
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 20,317
    It is not clear what is going to happen. All LEGO have said is that the winner will come from the top 3. They haven't said how the winner will be chosen, just that LEGO will not be transparent about the number of votes.
    MinifigInSpace
  • BumblepantsBumblepants DFW/BGMember Posts: 7,298
    CCC said:
    It is not clear what is going to happen. All LEGO have said is that the winner will come from the top 3. They haven't said how the winner will be chosen, just that LEGO will not be transparent about the number of votes.
    At least they are being transparent about not being transparent this time. An improvement over similar things they have done in the past.
    MinifigInSpaceandhecatwrangler
  • The_RancorThe_Rancor Dorset, UKMember Posts: 2,334
    edited January 2021
    I can’t imagine the structure of the top 3 changing in the shortlist vote, even if it was transparent or influenced the final result. When I was looking at the votes individually, Bionicle, Space and Pirates almost never overlapped in people’s 3 initial votes. There could be plenty of people like me who didn’t vote for any of the top 3 the first time, so might depend on what their preference is in the shortlist. I’ll probably vote for Classic Space - because POBB and the creator set are plenty good enough right now for Pirates and I can’t envisage wanting to buy a Bionicle set.

    The only narrowing factor TLG implemented was that the winner had to be from the top 3 shortlist. But they could always change that to expand (wishful thinking).
    MinifigInSpaceandhe
  • FauchFauch FranceMember Posts: 2,594
    I don't care for bionicle, but if it wins, there are already too much stuff I like anyway. I don't really get the pirates vote after we already got POBB and the creator ship.
    andhe
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 20,317
    I can’t imagine the structure of the top 3 changing in the shortlist vote, even if it was transparent or influenced the final result. When I was looking at the votes individually, Bionicle, Space and Pirates almost never overlapped in people’s 3 initial votes. There could be plenty of people like me who didn’t vote for any of the top 3 the first time, so might depend on what their preference is in the shortlist.
    Yes, there were many people that didn't vote for any of the top 3, so they may be the deciding factor in which theme gets the most votes (although not necessarily in deciding which theme gets made.) If they are "system only" people, then Bionicle will be hit. I imagine Classic Space will be appointed the winner, and we'll get a ship in Benny's spaceship colour scheme that many will like and some Classic Space fans will complain about being just wrong and an insult to real Classic Space.

    Bumblepants560HeliportThe_RancorMr_CrossMinifigInSpaceMaffyDgmonkey76
  • The_RancorThe_Rancor Dorset, UKMember Posts: 2,334
    CCC said:
    I can’t imagine the structure of the top 3 changing in the shortlist vote, even if it was transparent or influenced the final result. When I was looking at the votes individually, Bionicle, Space and Pirates almost never overlapped in people’s 3 initial votes. There could be plenty of people like me who didn’t vote for any of the top 3 the first time, so might depend on what their preference is in the shortlist.
    Yes, there were many people that didn't vote for any of the top 3, so they may be the deciding factor in which theme gets the most votes (although not necessarily in deciding which theme gets made.) If they are "system only" people, then Bionicle will be hit. I imagine Classic Space will be appointed the winner, and we'll get a ship in Benny's spaceship colour scheme that many will like and some Classic Space fans will complain about being just wrong and an insult to real Classic Space.

    If they make a new spaceman color the set could be styrofoam peanuts and people would still vote it set of the year
    It could literally be a polished turd and it would still be the set of the year...


    But I’m sure that would not be the case! Considering the theme fragmentation it could be a merger of space anyway considering the votes for Space Police and Blacktron which both have/consist of antagonists.
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Twin Cities, MN, USAMember Posts: 3,083
    CCC said:
    I can’t imagine the structure of the top 3 changing in the shortlist vote, even if it was transparent or influenced the final result. When I was looking at the votes individually, Bionicle, Space and Pirates almost never overlapped in people’s 3 initial votes. There could be plenty of people like me who didn’t vote for any of the top 3 the first time, so might depend on what their preference is in the shortlist.
    Yes, there were many people that didn't vote for any of the top 3, so they may be the deciding factor in which theme gets the most votes (although not necessarily in deciding which theme gets made.) If they are "system only" people, then Bionicle will be hit. I imagine Classic Space will be appointed the winner, and we'll get a ship in Benny's spaceship colour scheme that many will like and some Classic Space fans will complain about being just wrong and an insult to real Classic Space.

    If they make a new spaceman color the set could be styrofoam peanuts and people would still vote it set of the year
    It could literally be a polished turd and it would still be the set of the year...


    But I’m sure that would not be the case! Considering the theme fragmentation it could be a merger of space anyway considering the votes for Space Police and Blacktron which both have/consist of antagonists.
    Yes! Something like Space Police 3's #5973 Hyperspeed Pursuit: two pretty much equal vehicles.
    MinifigInSpace
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,979
    MaffyD said:
    I've got to say, I feel bad for all the 'Exclusively Bionicle' fans out there. It's obvious that this will be one of the top three, as it's first right now, by a long long way. I can't remember what happens after the top three are released, but can I have view on the options here?
    1. Bionicle wins, and TLG produce a new Bionicle set. How do they do this?  Resurrected moulds or brand new ones, some kind of technic/system hybrid or a 'recreated in bricks' homage display set (like the wooden duck).
    2. Bionicle doesn't win, because of the cost implications, logistical challenges, design issues or perceived consumer reaction to any of the options outlined in 1. above, and Lego alienate a massive bunch of people.
    3. Something else?
    For me, obviously I have a desire for a set from a particular theme. If I don't get one, I will probably not buy the set they do make, but I'm ok with that - there's plenty of other stuff I can buy.
    But for those fans of Bionicle who want that more than anything else, like, by a lot - they have nothing else that fills that void for them. There's got to be a better result than that, hasn't there?
    I'd appreciate counter-arguments to this - I'm sure I'm missing things or assuming things.
    Well, as a Bionicle fan, I wouldn't mind option #1 in the slightest, and I suspect a lot of other Bionicle fans wouldn't, either — even a lot of fans who'd be adamantly opposed to Bionicle getting a complete System-based revival probably wouldn't mind an individual System-based tribute set, especially if it were designed at an 18+ level of detail that allowed for plenty of the sort of mechanical greebling that Bionicle parts are known for.
    Furthermore, the chances of LEGO being able to create a truly heartfelt Bionicle tribute using System elements are probably helped by the fact that some of their current designers like Nick Vas and Niek van Slagmaat have not only proven their mastery at designing highly detailed sets (including brick-built mechs and creatures for themes like Ninjago), but are also long-time Bionicle fans themselves — to the point of tweeting about this poll using the "TeamBionicle" hashtag, encouraging fellow Bionicle fans to vote for that theme:
    Bionicle also ran for long enough (with enough design changes over the course of that time) for its fans to understand even better than some System fans do that molds don't tend to stay in production indefinitely — after all, a lot of the parts from the theme's early years had already been retired even before the theme got discontinued for the first time in 2010!
    Of course, there will still be some Bionicle fans who would have unrealistic expectations for LEGO to bring back the theme EXACTLY as they remember it — classic molds and all — but the same can be said for a lot of themes. Plenty of System themes like Aquazone, M:Tron, and Dragon Knights would probably need pretty major design changes themselves to adapt them into a modern set, considering how many defining elements of their designs like windscreens, magnets, grabber arms, and classic LEGO dragons have long been discontinued.
    In general, it's best not to judge the entire fanbase of any theme by its most ornery or demanding members.
    Mr_CrossstluxMaffyDAyliffeBrickBeltsklambCymbelinecatwrangler
  • BumblepantsBumblepants DFW/BGMember Posts: 7,298
    Maybe I am misremembering but the Bionicle revival after Hero Factory went away seemed to meet the same response as the last Pirates line. Those with nostalgia for the line decided they didn't like it much for whatever reason and no one new to the theme seemed to latch onto it either.
    sklamb
  • MaffyDMaffyD West YorkshireMember Posts: 3,242
    @Aanchir - thank you for the response. That's the kind of feedback I was after. For the avoidance of doubt, I wasn't trying to judge an entire fanbase, but perhaps I shouldn't have illustrated my question with perhaps the worse-case scenario!

    Every fandom is full of great people! :-)
    sklambMinifigInSpaceandheAanchir
  • B1zB1z USAMember Posts: 11
    edited February 2021
    CCC said:

    I still don't think a single theme should have been used to represent or celebrate the anniversary. Barely anything lasts longer than ten years so whatever they pick will represent a small portion of both their history and fanbase and may well lead to more fans not wanting it than wanting it. Which is why having something celebrating their history not linked to any one theme may have been better for a one off set. A plain old school town set or even a Classic Box with retro styled parts is more appealing to me than most other themes. There are plenty of themes currently on the shelves that I am not interested in and I do not buy, and LEGO doing one more set from a theme I am not interested in with a 90th anniversary badge on it is not really any different, the only difference is that it will have the 90th anniversary badge on it. Whereas something that celebrated their history not linked to just one theme might have been more interesting.



    Overall, I agree with @CCC . I am also definitely a fan of Bionicle, and would like to see it reimagined in a new way within system, but I also fully see and understand how no single theme (including Bionicle!) could possibly adequately represent a celebration of LEGO's 90th anniversary.

    This event should be a fun thing - first and foremost - that LEGO has offered to fans, but it seems that because of the special context someone is going to be displeased no matter what the outcome! I hope this won't be made into some sort of debacle. Let's hope for a proper celebration!
    MinifigInSpaceCymbelineAanchirBrickBelt
  • Russell844Russell844 California, USAMember Posts: 2,268
    Collecting Bionicle from the very beginnings was something me and my ex-wife did. I collected all the red characters and she collected all the blue characters. She was never really a LEGO fan but this was something we could do together.
    AanchirBrickBeltB1z
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