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Looking for suggestions of places for custom printing

VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
I've got a small project I've been working on & I'm wanting a few prints that already exist, but I'm needing them on parts in different colours to what TLG have produced, so I was wanting to know of anyone has a setup that can pull it off & possibly an approximate cost I'd be looking at to get it done. The parts are as follows:

2X2 Round Brick W. Knob "No.1000" (98100pb05)
Element No: 6059017
Design No: 16390
Colour: Medium Stone Grey (Light Bluish Gray)
Part colour wanted: White

Flat Tile 2X2, Round "Tie" (14769pb025)
Element No: 6052205
Design No: 74405
Colour: Medium Stone Grey (Light Bluish Gray)
Part colour wanted: White

Roof Tile 1X2X2/3 (85984pb127)
Element No: 6152814
Design No: 26823
Colour: Dark Stone Grey (Dark Bluish Gray)
Part colour wanted: Medium Stone Grey (Light Bluish Gray)

I have tried to track down a quote from a few places that have been mentioned in connection with custom prints in the past. So far, I've contacted Brickin It Customs, Bricksanity, Firestar Toys & the Big Brick, still waiting to hear back from any of them.

Comments

  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    Just so everyone knows what parts I'm talking about:

    FowlerBricks
  • DiggydoesDiggydoes Cologne/GermanyMember Posts: 1,074
    Maybe you wanna ask here for quotes too?: https://steindrucker.com
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    Those designs are copyright and legitimate businesses like the ones you've listed shouldn't be reproducing them.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    @Aleydita, wow! You haven't ever visited one of the various businesses that are offering these services have you? Most of them sell various minifigures that the names are a play on words, or substitute parts of the character name for Lego related terms, such as Jack Brickton (aka Jack Burton, the main character from the film Big Trouble In Little China), DeathPot (a play on the name Deadpool), Brick Lee (aka Bruce Lee), etc. Something tells me, taking a TLG design already available on a light bluish gray brick & recreating it on the exact same TLG element, but it's white or red instead, is probably far less of a legal concern than what half of them already do.

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    VorpalRyu said:
    @Aleydita, wow! You haven't ever visited one of the various businesses that are offering these services have you? Most of them sell various minifigures that the names are a play on words, or substitute parts of the character name for Lego related terms, such as Jack Brickton (aka Jack Burton, the main character from the film Big Trouble In Little China), DeathPot (a play on the name Deadpool), Brick Lee (aka Bruce Lee), etc. Something tells me, taking a TLG design already available on a light bluish gray brick & recreating it on the exact same TLG element, but it's white or red instead, is probably far less of a legal concern than what half of them already do.

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
    I'm familiar with all of those you listed, and have ordered from most of them. I know at least one was sued on copyright grounds. It's perhaps why they aren't replying to your request, that's all I was trying to say. I suspect it's far more legal - copyright wise - to sell a character called DeathPot than it is to sell one called Deadpool.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    @Aleydita, from everything I've come across about this sort of thing, by using a name like DeathPot (instead of the actual character name), a good lawyer can argue that they definitely knew that they were in breach of copyrights, trademarks, etc & can lead to heavier penalties being imposed on the sellers/makers. As I'm asking for them to create it for me, it can be defended as a commissioned work, which the seller/maker can then potentially push liability for any copyright claims, trademark infringements, etc, onto the person requesting the commissioned pieces. The designs are effectively line art, far less complex than say a comic book or film character, so the likelihood that TLG could successfully sue over it isn't probably going to be very high.
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    I doubt they would ever sue, but a legit company doing it for one customer opens up the possibility they'll do it for several. That might raise some eyebrows.

    For years I published a football website and on two separate occasions I had to fight a local newspaper and a national newspaper (the Non-League Paper) that plagiarised my work. Both denied it initially, even though the local paper's report was virtually word for word the same as mine. The NLP refused any contact until after I pointed out that they'd copied fake news reports I published specifically to catch them out. Managed to get printed apologies out of both after doing a bit of research.

    Doesn't mean I know much about copyright, but I do know it isn't necessarily about the value lost.
  • DiggydoesDiggydoes Cologne/GermanyMember Posts: 1,074
    VorpalRyu said:
    @Aleydita, wow! You haven't ever visited one of the various businesses that are offering these services have you? Most of them sell various minifigures that the names are a play on words, or substitute parts of the character name for Lego related terms, such as Jack Brickton (aka Jack Burton, the main character from the film Big Trouble In Little China), DeathPot (a play on the name Deadpool), Brick Lee (aka Bruce Lee), etc. Something tells me, taking a TLG design already available on a light bluish gray brick & recreating it on the exact same TLG element, but it's white or red instead, is probably far less of a legal concern than what half of them already do.

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
    Jup, they do printed replacement parts! I have the Ghostbuster HQ Set from them at hand, Quality is def. spot on, but not cheap :/
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    Diggydoes said:
    VorpalRyu said:
    @Aleydita, wow! You haven't ever visited one of the various businesses that are offering these services have you? Most of them sell various minifigures that the names are a play on words, or substitute parts of the character name for Lego related terms, such as Jack Brickton (aka Jack Burton, the main character from the film Big Trouble In Little China), DeathPot (a play on the name Deadpool), Brick Lee (aka Bruce Lee), etc. Something tells me, taking a TLG design already available on a light bluish gray brick & recreating it on the exact same TLG element, but it's white or red instead, is probably far less of a legal concern than what half of them already do.

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
    Jup, they do printed replacement parts! I have the Ghostbuster HQ Set from them at hand, Quality is def. spot on, but not cheap :/
    ...and then they end up in the aftermarket being sold as genuine Lego items. VorpalRyu's could well end up being sold for a small fortune as rare non-released items. This is why copyright should be respected.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    Aleydita said:
    Diggydoes said:
    VorpalRyu said:

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
    Jup, they do printed replacement parts! I have the Ghostbuster HQ Set from them at hand, Quality is def. spot on, but not cheap :/
    ...and then they end up in the aftermarket being sold as genuine Lego items.
    Yeah, no, not even close to being true, the knowledge of them is too widespread, a quick net search would reveal their origin to the uninformed (people buying "rare" parts tend to do research). Also there are enough Lego experts like Istokg around that have knowledge of TLG's back catalog of inventory that eventually someone would do a write up on said parts & their actual origins.

    This might have been a potential issue twenty-thirty years ago, but then, back then, who other than TLG had access to equipment to produce results on the same level as TLG at that time? Only those with serious cash, serious enough not to need to rely on selling fake "rare" parts for income.

    Aleydita said:

    VorpalRyu's could well end up being sold for a small fortune as rare non-released items.
    Yeah, sure, again, no... Considering what I want these parts for, their origins will be clearly documented, as I plan to release the instructions to the build these are for (let's be clear here, I don't charge for my instructions, so I won't be making any money out of this venture). If the business that supplies me with my parts is interested in supplying others with those parts, the most I'll be doing is providing a link to their site.

    As for what that build is, it's the Solo Story version of my Special Edition Millennium Falcon Microfighter:


    & my Original Trilogy Special Edition Millennium Falcon Microfighter:


    Aleydita said:

    This is why copyright should be respected.
    Considering your previous statement about ordering items through most of these third party Lego printing companies, I do have my doubts as to the sincerity of your statement. If you've bought even one minifigure or part that breeches someone else's copyrights or trademarks, then your statement is nothing more than disingenuous virtue signalling.

    To be brutally honest, I would much prefer to be able to order the parts direct from TLG, I'm not completely thrilled that I need to go down this path to get the printed parts I'm needing. Up until just recently, I was only considering using the official printed parts or unprinted parts in the correct colours, but now I have most of the parts for this build, I can see that neither option will do it justice, especially since it will be displayed right next to the OT SE version that has printed parts in the right colours.

    Heck, if TLG came to me & said, we'd like to release these as official sets & all I'd get out of the deal is a couple of copies of the sets, I'd take that deal (I'd try to avoid them becoming SDCC sets, I'd try to push for a secondary general release with different minifigs).

    As it stands, I still need three parts that aren't available in the colours I need for these two builds, it's been suggested numerous times I should just get them 3d printed (will not be happening) or I could paint them (again, not happening). I'm just hoping against hope that these parts will turn up some time soon (which is infinitely more likely than the printed parts I'm needing).
  • Baby_YodaBaby_Yoda The world's backsideMember Posts: 1,193
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the custom printed part would need to be protected under fair use. It'd generally need to be transformative and non-commercial - the latter point being the kicker. I believe courts tend to prefer the average citizen over for-profit companies when it comes to copyright infringement. It might be okay if you can find a way to avoid paying directly for the print or by printing it yourself. The simple design of the print might also help you, but since it's on the same part I doubt it. I only have a basic knowledge of copyright law, though, so if I'm wrong tell me.
    And then of course the company has to be willing in the first place, but I doubt anyone will risk it.
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    VorpalRyu said:
    Aleydita said:
    Diggydoes said:
    VorpalRyu said:

    @Diggydoes, awesome suggestion, didn't even think of them, probably should have, because if memory serves, aren't they the guys that do printed replacement parts for the SW UCS sets?
    Jup, they do printed replacement parts! I have the Ghostbuster HQ Set from them at hand, Quality is def. spot on, but not cheap :/
    ...and then they end up in the aftermarket being sold as genuine Lego items.
    Yeah, no, not even close to being true, the knowledge of them is too widespread, a quick net search would reveal their origin to the uninformed (people buying "rare" parts tend to do research). Also there are enough Lego experts like Istokg around that have knowledge of TLG's back catalog of inventory that eventually someone would do a write up on said parts & their actual origins.

    This might have been a potential issue twenty-thirty years ago, but then, back then, who other than TLG had access to equipment to produce results on the same level as TLG at that time? Only those with serious cash, serious enough not to need to rely on selling fake "rare" parts for income.

    Aleydita said:

    VorpalRyu's could well end up being sold for a small fortune as rare non-released items.
    Yeah, sure, again, no... Considering what I want these parts for, their origins will be clearly documented, as I plan to release the instructions to the build these are for (let's be clear here, I don't charge for my instructions, so I won't be making any money out of this venture). If the business that supplies me with my parts is interested in supplying others with those parts, the most I'll be doing is providing a link to their site.

    As for what that build is, it's the Solo Story version of my Special Edition Millennium Falcon Microfighter:


    & my Original Trilogy Special Edition Millennium Falcon Microfighter:


    Aleydita said:

    This is why copyright should be respected.
    Considering your previous statement about ordering items through most of these third party Lego printing companies, I do have my doubts as to the sincerity of your statement. If you've bought even one minifigure or part that breeches someone else's copyrights or trademarks, then your statement is nothing more than disingenuous virtue signalling.

    To be brutally honest, I would much prefer to be able to order the parts direct from TLG, I'm not completely thrilled that I need to go down this path to get the printed parts I'm needing. Up until just recently, I was only considering using the official printed parts or unprinted parts in the correct colours, but now I have most of the parts for this build, I can see that neither option will do it justice, especially since it will be displayed right next to the OT SE version that has printed parts in the right colours.

    Heck, if TLG came to me & said, we'd like to release these as official sets & all I'd get out of the deal is a couple of copies of the sets, I'd take that deal (I'd try to avoid them becoming SDCC sets, I'd try to push for a secondary general release with different minifigs).

    As it stands, I still need three parts that aren't available in the colours I need for these two builds, it's been suggested numerous times I should just get them 3d printed (will not be happening) or I could paint them (again, not happening). I'm just hoping against hope that these parts will turn up some time soon (which is infinitely more likely than the printed parts I'm needing).
    For all the knowledge in the AFOL community, if a printed piece by Lego is indistinguishable from a printed piece by a third-party, as I believe @diggydoes suggested, how would it be possible to prevent the third-party pieces from entering the after-market?

    As for you doubting my statement that I've purchased from those stores, that's you outright calling me a liar, so knickers to you. Believe what you like, clearly you will anyway. I've ordered custom printed stuff from all over the place, but you obviously know better. My issue isn't that these companies do what they do, it's that some people want them to go a step further and outright duplicate something that would be indistinguishable from a genuine Lego design.

    @baby_yoda, my gut feeling is that I don't think it would. We're not talking about copying a small part of a larger work, or reproducing something for educational purposes or usual fair use exceptions. But as I said, my knowledge of copyright law is limited, and they probably differ from country to country in any case.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    Aleydita said:

    For all the knowledge in the AFOL community, if a printed piece by Lego is indistinguishable from a printed piece by a third-party, as I believe @diggydoes suggested, how would it be possible to prevent the third-party pieces from entering the after-market?
    You totally missed the point of what I was saying, no-one would be able stop these parts getting into the after-market, that was not my point. My point is that plenty of people within the AFOL community know the origin of the parts, it would take a complete noob that does no research & ignores all advice given on these parts to actually believe them to be "rare" unreleased official TLG printed items. When buying "rare" parts, the community usually has a buyer beware attitude & tend to try to dig up info about the parts on offer, I know I have with the ones I've bought in the past, if you just take some eBay store owner's word for it & don't look a bit deeper, more the fool you, I'm not the Lego police & neither are you.

    Aleydita said:

    As for you doubting my statement that I've purchased from those stores, that's you outright calling me a liar, so knickers to you. Believe what you like, clearly you will anyway. I've ordered custom printed stuff from all over the place, but you obviously know better. My issue isn't that these companies do what they do, it's that some people want them to go a step further and outright duplicate something that would be indistinguishable from a genuine Lego design.
    Again, a swing & a miss....the point completely. I wasn't doubting that you have money & buy stuff. I was saying that have you ever bought any of the items these sites sell that is of a questionable nature, like a DeathPot minifig or Air Vent Bruce, etc, etc, then your statement about copyright is just disingenuous virtue signalling, as you have purchased items that breech copyrights &/or trademarks. Really making me think I hit a nerve there with the fact that you "missed" such an obvious point & when off on some weird tangent about calling you a liar about spending money (still trying to figure how you went there from what I said).
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    Wow you really are a condescending piece of shit, huh? Who knows whether or not Lego will ever release the designs you want in the colours you want? If they do, yours may at some unknown point in the future may be passed off as genuine. Even if they never appear in those colours officially, that doesn't stop the same thing happening. No amount of checks and balances would necessarily prevent it. We already know that duplicates of some early Star Wars prints have entered the after-market, and despite being widely known about, they still sell to unsuspecting or uncaring buyers.

    Regards swinging and missing, how about you just accept the fact that you have no idea about my buying habits, huh? If you don't want 'virtue signalling' thrown at you, maybe don't use a public forum to ask for recommendations of third party printers who care as much about copyright as you (i.e. not at all). I wonder if you're one of those who object to Lepin outright stealing Lego's designs, box art, etc.
  • dmcc0dmcc0 Nae far fae AberdeenMember Posts: 694
    The difference may be that most of the sites mentioned above don't seem reproduce existing designs; minifigs are all custom designs as far as I can tell and the same applies to the parts.  May be an issue that in this case they are exact reproductions, albeit on a different coloured brick.

    No doubt these websites are actually in breach of copyright/IP law with some of the things they sell (although IANAL) but doubt the IP holders are too bothered by it as they are all relatively small outfits and producing figs that would likely never be made anyway, so not directly competing with them.  Or maybe just unaware of them; they are not exactly high street names and most outwith the LEGO community probably don't know they exist.
  • mustang69mustang69 North CarolinaMember Posts: 380
    If @VorpalRyu was looking to have 100s of these printed up I think then maybe there would be a concern they might end up being passed off as genuine parts. Considering he is only looking to make (I'm assuming) a few of each for his personal use then I think it's best to just let AFOLs be AFOLs and do their MOCs.

    Everyone is talking about what ifs here, how about we wait and see if someone starts trying to sell these as genuine then we can talk about how it could have been prevented, in this case.
    VorpalRyu
  • Baby_YodaBaby_Yoda The world's backsideMember Posts: 1,193
    @VorpalRyu
    @Aleydita
    For a forum that is usually quite peaceful, it always astounds me when debates turn into insults and bickering over such trivial subjects. You're arguing over the legality of reproducing the decoration on a toy brick, but you sound like a pair of quick-tempered blokes who crashed into each other and demand the other pay compensation. Keep it civil.
    560Heliportmustang69datsunrobbiemak0137snowhitieFowlerBricksKungFuKenny
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    Aleydita said:
    Wow you really are a condescending piece of shit, huh? Who knows whether or not Lego will ever release the designs you want in the colours you want? If they do, yours may at some unknown point in the future may be passed off as genuine. Even if they never appear in those colours officially, that doesn't stop the same thing happening. No amount of checks and balances would necessarily prevent it. We already know that duplicates of some early Star Wars prints have entered the after-market, and despite being widely known about, they still sell to unsuspecting or uncaring buyers.
    Condescending? Wow! I'm not the one trying to be the Lego police & tell people how to play with their Lego, but hey, you do you. As for TLG releasing what I'm after, I'm not expecting it will happen, which is why I'm looking into get a third party to print a couple for my own personal collection, for use in a MOC, hardly something that is even close to the scale of disaster you're banging on about.

    Aleydita said:
    Regards swinging and missing, how about you just accept the fact that you have no idea about my buying habits, huh? If you don't want 'virtue signalling' thrown at you, maybe don't use a public forum to ask for recommendations of third party printers who care as much about copyright as you (i.e. not at all). I wonder if you're one of those who object to Lepin outright stealing Lego's designs, box art, etc.
    I don't want to know about your buying habits, I honestly couldn't care less. I was just stating that if you're buying certain previously mentioned items from those websites, your statements about copyright are worth nada, the fact you keep responding with the umbrage that you do, tends to make it look like my statement rings true to some degree.

    As for not wanting virtue signaling, you said it yourself, it's 'public forum,' not your personal blog, you've given your two cents, repeatedly, mayhaps it might be time to jog on?

    As for how much I care about copyright, you don't know jack about me, fact is I've seen a few minifigures from these businesses I thought were pretty cool, but knowing how it's pretty much IP theft, I have never been able to justify the idea of buying them. I have a good collection of written works, that should I get off my ass about it, I might look to get published some day, which is why I wouldn't buy those minifigs, can't expect the law to protect my claims when I happily buy stuff that breeches the claims of others, heck I won't even buy TeeFury or TeePublic products unless the art is original works or actual 100% parody. If you're really curious you could read the thread on TLG's battles with the chinese knock-offs, heard from others that it's a good read for a rainy afternoon.

    If my plans offend you so much, I'd suggest you run & tell TLG, but considering when I last placed an order by phone, the CS person & I got to talking about what some of the parts were for, part of which was my Solo Story Microfighter. They agreed, it would be nice if they could offer the parts with the prints I'd need, but they lamented that they don't offer such a service, they then suggested I could try Firestar & their supervisor threw them the other suggestion of BrickSanity, both wished me luck in my endeavor.
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    Oh dear. I mean, I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it for you.

    You think it's very naughty of them to produce a parody Deadpool, but are perfectly happy that they recreate an actual Lego design because it's for your personal project.

    Lego CS are not Lego legal.

    As for not caring about my buying habits, you aren't half getting your knickers in a twist based on your assumptions about them.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    mustang69 said:
    If @VorpalRyu was looking to have 100s of these printed up I think then maybe there would be a concern they might end up being passed off as genuine parts. Considering he is only looking to make (I'm assuming) a few of each for his personal use then I think it's best to just let AFOLs be AFOLs and do their MOCs.

    Everyone is talking about what ifs here, how about we wait and see if someone starts trying to sell these as genuine then we can talk about how it could have been prevented, in this case.
    I'm only really looking to get a few done, a set for my current MOC, a spare set & a couple extras for potential future MOCs. Though, it does seem that the guys that have gotten back to me so far are thinking some people may want to build my MOC, or at the very least have a couple these parts for themselves, this was one of the questions I got asked; "Do you have any feel for how many people might want to purchase the parts based on your previous projects?" I'd like to think it's just my MOC, but it's just a Microfighter, I can't see there being a very high demand for it.
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu AustraliaMember Posts: 2,237
    Aleydita said:

    Oh dear. I mean, I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it for you.
    & I'm the condescending one? Really! Such low weight high IQ, hey?

    Aleydita said:

    You think it's very naughty of them to produce a parody Deadpool, but are perfectly happy that they recreate an actual Lego design because it's for your personal project.
    From all I've been able ascertain (including discussions with lawyer friend of ours), my request would, at least in Australia, be regarded as a commissioned work for personal use, which is a marginally grey area under the law. Should the business choose to make what I requested in larger volume & sell to the general public, that's on them, but they probably have a much better idea as to how that would play out legally for them. Personally, if I have a choice of quotes from companies making "custom character" minifigs & those that aren't, even if the ones not doing so are a bit higher, I'd say there's the ones I'll be going with.

    Aleydita said:

    Lego CS are not Lego legal.

    As for not caring about my buying habits, you aren't half getting your knickers in a twist based on your assumptions about them.
    You don't say, my point is, they clearly have had stuff like this come up before, so their legal department is probably quiet aware of this sort of thing & the fact that TLG seemingly hasn't put word out there on this, they probably have less issue with this sort of thing than you do.

    Aleydita said:

    As for not caring about my buying habits, you aren't half getting your knickers in a twist based on your assumptions about them.
    Still on about this? Yeaaah, nuff said...
  • AleyditaAleydita BelgiumMember Posts: 788
    VorpalRyu said:
    Aleydita said:

    Oh dear. I mean, I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it for you.
    & I'm the condescending one? Really! Such low weight high IQ, hey?

    Aleydita said:

    You think it's very naughty of them to produce a parody Deadpool, but are perfectly happy that they recreate an actual Lego design because it's for your personal project.
    From all I've been able ascertain (including discussions with lawyer friend of ours), my request would, at least in Australia, be regarded as a commissioned work for personal use, which is a marginally grey area under the law. Should the business choose to make what I requested in larger volume & sell to the general public, that's on them, but they probably have a much better idea as to how that would play out legally for them. Personally, if I have a choice of quotes from companies making "custom character" minifigs & those that aren't, even if the ones not doing so are a bit higher, I'd say there's the ones I'll be going with.

    Aleydita said:

    Lego CS are not Lego legal.

    As for not caring about my buying habits, you aren't half getting your knickers in a twist based on your assumptions about them.
    You don't say, my point is, they clearly have had stuff like this come up before, so their legal department is probably quiet aware of this sort of thing & the fact that TLG seemingly hasn't put word out there on this, they probably have less issue with this sort of thing than you do.

    Aleydita said:

    As for not caring about my buying habits, you aren't half getting your knickers in a twist based on your assumptions about them.
    Still on about this? Yeaaah, nuff said...
    It's not marginally grey at all. It's almost certainly illegal to duplicate an existing design. Would you be okay to commission a copy of the Mona Lisa for personal use? Or is it simply a question of scale? You're talking nonsense and you know it. Trying to suggest the thing you're not interested in is questionable but the thing you want can't possibly be anything other than fair use.

    And yeah, I got a little annoyed about how you spoke to me after all I did was try and suggest a reason why the companies you mentioned hadn't returned your contact. Cry me a river.
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