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Rollercoaster project - combining sets and motorizing it

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  • datsunrobbiedatsunrobbie West Haven , CTMember Posts: 1,802
    Building columns is a spot where mixing Duplo and standard Lego could come in handy and save some cash. A 2x2 Duplo will attach to a pair of 2x4 or 4 2x2 standard bricks. Quatro bricks will fit with Duplo if you want to really get some height with a minimum number of bricks, but the ones I have seen don't have the glossy finish that Duplo and standard bricks have got.
    Phantom107mak0137Baby_Yodakiki180703
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    That track looks very cool! The chain uses a huge amount of links, what you can consider instead is making a lift that goes vertically to the top, with the train on a piece of track.

    Alright so I built it up again, a little better this time as I’m learning. It’s gone much faster as I have a better idea of planning it out since I started. Now that I put the double columns in at the chainlift areas I ran out of white round blocks, I need to figure out some construction things to take the round pieces out so I can use those to get the track closed. And then I get get to further refinement. This time the track is also placed centered on the green plates, I figured that out too.



    stevecook132ricecakekiki180703
  • nexandernexander Glasgow Member Posts: 908
    Addicted2Oxygen said:

    Next experiment will be making a motorised chain lift - once I find all the suitable parts. 
    Good luck! 

    If you don't want to mess about with rollers etc at the top 180 curve I would suggest putting a small dip at the top like the pirate rollercoaster. Does mean some layout changes and a bit less momentum further along the track though.
    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    nexander said:

    If you don't want to mess about with rollers etc at the top 180 curve I would suggest putting a small dip at the top like the pirate rollercoaster. Does mean some layout changes and a bit less momentum further along the track though.

    Yes I've been considering this, I think it will make the ride more fun, and less construction required, but I'll indeed have to see how momentum is impacted by this.
  • nexandernexander Glasgow Member Posts: 908
    Phantom107 said:

    Yes I've been considering this, I think it will make the ride more fun, and less construction required, but I'll indeed have to see how momentum is impacted by this.
    You might have an issue as you have a turn, a straight then a turn. A bigger first dip would sort it.

    There is another issue i discovered when motorizing over a hump, you have to be very careful when you release the carts from the chain. Release it at the top of the hill you loose momentum as the first cart is on the flat as the 3rd is held by the chain and it doesn't go far. 

    My modded carts didn't help but I ended up using 2 carts and putting a subtle twist inwards in the 180 bend.

    Again a bigger first dip and stopping the chain just before the top of hill would work.
    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    I think it’s more interesting with the dip at the start, but now the entire thing has shifted down and I had to take out an angled piece... now the coaster can’t make it, see the slow motion video. I’m trying to figure out the best way to make the chainlift without the double columns, and I’m going to add the angled piece into the first chainlift to lift the track up again... there is room and I know I won’t be satisfied with the track if I hadn’t absolutely maximized all opportunity. So I’m going to go back to CAD and see if this can be solved.

    https://youtu.be/6Ag9VYyZlos

    Mr_Cross
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Alright I already know what to do, lift the entire track a couple pieces so there is just enough room for the angled slope to go back in where it was, and then the train will make it.
  • Addicted2OxygenAddicted2Oxygen Somewhere behind all the boxes of LegoMember Posts: 467
    Structural support is not optional. 

    The result of a gentle brush against the tracks


    Phantom107Johnyk668kiki180703
  • PaperballparkPaperballpark Near ManchesterMember Posts: 4,257
    See, the coasters I always think are most impressive are those that are built into the landscape. So what you need to do there is to build a big hill that the coaster goes up (and back down again), with lots of undulations for the rest of the track. That'd look especially impressive, plus it'd solve all your support issues! ;)
    Phantom107Addicted2Oxygenmak0137msandersMr_Crosskiki180703
  • HugeYellowBrickHugeYellowBrick At my PCMember Posts: 496
    ^ I thought of using #21137 The Mountain Cave with the Roller Coaster, because part of the job is already done...

    Phantom107AstrobricksBumblepantsmak0137560HeliportBaby_Yodakiki180703
  • Addicted2OxygenAddicted2Oxygen Somewhere behind all the boxes of LegoMember Posts: 467
    @Paperballpark yes that is one of my ideas.

    Currently I am just playing around to get a feel for what track layouts work, and what can and can’t be done with the tracks. I am fully aware of the fragility of how I am stacking bricks. 

    Decided to modify the layout to make it a bit more compact and try and add in more momentum. Conclusion is that it needs to be higher and have longer straights after the drop.  The corners suck the momentum away, but are exciting when the cars zoom around them. 

    Also added a quick tunnel. Definitely want a longer one to fully hide the cars for part of the coaster.

    from the top the cars go to the join between the sand and blue plates at the front. So if I can raise everything before that and get one more drop it might make it to the start. I probably ought to look at how the official one is laid out. 


    Phantom107
  • nexandernexander Glasgow Member Posts: 908
    @Phantom107 could you have it single column most of the way then split it to two columns for the chain to feed through? Like this, it's pretty strong.
    Phantom107
  • eMJeeNLeMJeeNL The NetherlandsMember Posts: 749
    edited August 2018
    Still following your project intently...

    No intention to highjack your thread, but just my first thoughts on the 10261 after finishing it yesterday:

    1. Wow.
    2. Just: Wow.
    3. My wife says "this is the most enthusiastic i've ever seen you about Legos"

    Now for some more relevant thoughts:
    4. It's very structurally sound... (easily picked up by two hands when assembled (at the right points, there where the supports are joined to the frame by balljoints))
    5. ...at least until you motorise it. Then the upward slope gets unstuck quickly; this morning when showing it to my sons it go to the point where the chain became unstuck. I think the main problem is the instability of the slope where the pieces are not supported. What also doesn't help is the fact that where the chain is supported by the little "wheels" the construction of the "wheelhouse" - which in turn supports the track- isn't very sturdy. It looks like it actually budges quite a bit. Will look into strengthening this point.
    6. Cool details, only, where do the people wanting to ride the train/leaving the ride get on/off the little pathway? (just a little nag)
    7. It could have used some more flags (e.g. along the upward slope, plenty of points to stick some more on there, and on/around the platform).
    Addicted2OxygenPhantom107kiki180703
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    edited August 2018



    Cool! From what I've tested and seen, I think you're losing a lot of momentum by putting corners directly after the drops, in those cases the cars are not only grinding on the bottom of the track but also lose alot on the sides because it has to grind the edge to go through the corner so fast. See if you can use 34738 after the 26559 piece and then make a corner...  and after the large drop definately make it go up again if possible. I'm doing this in my own design too, after each drop I make it go back up again, so it gains height again, then it's slowed through the corner which is a lot better for momentum.

    I'm curious too how much the bricks on that train influence the ride, have you tried stripping the train to make it lighter?

    https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-FQsd0Qt8jGk/WhmFEeaVF8I/AAAAAAAAII8/YGPTCZ-QTXw6rNzUL1CTtAdGYwzDtFO8wCEwYBhgL/s1600/08-All-Five-Track-Elements-NUmbers.jpg




    eMJeeNL said:
    Still following your project intently...

    No intention to highjack your thread, but just my first thoughts on the 10261 after finishing it yesterday:


    Feel free to post!


    5. ...at least until you motorise it. Then the upward slope gets unstuck quickly; this morning when showing it to my sons it go to the point where the chain became unstuck. I think the main problem is the instability of the slope where the pieces are not supported. What also doesn't help is the fact that where the chain is supported by the little "wheels" the construction of the "wheelhouse" - which in turn supports the track- isn't very sturdy. It looks like it actually budges quite a bit. Will look into strengthening this point.

    This didn't happen for me, but what I did was disobey the amount of links they specified in the manual and simply tried different amounts to see what worked best. Now I'm building those (slightly) custom chainlifts, I've noticed how even adding or removing a single link can really influence the smoothness of the chain. It has to with the way the chain resonates, if this is in the wrong spot then it will continue to rockitself increasingly more and then problems happen.

  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    nexander said:
    @Phantom107 could you have it single column most of the way then split it to two columns for the chain to feed through? Like this, it's pretty strong.

    Yes I'm doing something like that, except I'm using some parts that keep the chain in it's place from the original set, which I don't need in my lower chainlift. So I can make the following thing twice, so two columns: 



  • nexandernexander Glasgow Member Posts: 908
    I'm curious too how much the bricks on that train influence the ride, 
    A lot! It's not just the weight, it's the distribution and balance as well. 

    To get an idea I would try it with 2 cars and change them about to see the difference with different front/back heavy combinations 
    Phantom107
  • sid3windrsid3windr BelgiumMember Posts: 1,460
    For people in the Amazing Modular Buildings group on Facebook, here's 2 sets linked together over a bit of Minecraft mountain: https://www.facebook.com/groups/374399256063320/permalink/1053191591517413/

    Phantom107
  • Baby_YodaBaby_Yoda The world's backsideMember Posts: 1,295
    ^ Is it possible for an image to uploaded here?
    stluxPhantom107kiki180703
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 5,387
    Baby_Yoda said:
    ^ Is it possible for an image to uploaded here?
    Yes please. I don’t do FB.
    Phantom107
  • FauchFauch FranceMember Posts: 2,645
    I actually have nothing lego on my facebook, except for a guy I met on a Timesplitters group, and I found out later he used to be a master builder in legoland
    Phantom107
  • Addicted2OxygenAddicted2Oxygen Somewhere behind all the boxes of LegoMember Posts: 467
    Yes adding an up after a down helped and not immediately having a corner also helped. 

    After a bit of a redesign the cars can now return to the start. Currently only the stripped down cars work and not the heavy shark one.

    It is very pleasing to have the cars return to the start. 


    Phantom107RogerKirkmustang69kiki180703
  • ArtfulDodgerArtfulDodger Member Posts: 105
    My dream Coaster MOC would be for Big Thunder Mountain from Walt Disney World. It was my first coaster, and remains one of my favorites.





    Looking at the BTM blueprints, I'm estimating that it would take at least 4 Coasters worth of track to complete. 

    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Thanks, I love iterating on it and posting the findings. It's fun to keep pushing it to see what's possible.

    Speaking of which... not all trains make it to the end, this is concerning.

    I've found the following: doing 2 corners in a row ruins the train's performance... but if you do corner - small curve down - corner - repeat then it seems it works nicely. A double corner just chips away the momentum too much.


    Addicted2Oxygen
  • eMJeeNLeMJeeNL The NetherlandsMember Posts: 749
    I agreed with Switchfoot, its great to see you progress.

    meanwhile, i can report the selfdestruction reported earlier was mostly due to running with a 6-car train or two trains close to eachother. It really doesnt like it when the chain has to pull more than 3 carriages.
    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Alright so I built the first prototype of the 2nd chainlift and something is not smooth. This time I watched it carefully and cut off power at the exact moment it got stuck and the motor was about to rip the entire thing down... it’s now sitting in place. If it holds up like this I’ll make a picture in the morning where the lighting is a lot better.




  • PaperballparkPaperballpark Near ManchesterMember Posts: 4,257
    Those supports don't look good!
    sid3windrdmcc0Baby_Yodakiki180703
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Actually the supports shouldn’t technically be the problem, it ran very well for a few minutes - then somehow it got out of balance, the chain got stuck and the motor (which is very powerful I’ve noticed) just pulls the entire thing down. I need to figure out how to balance the chain so it doesn’t happen. The supports should carry the track, not give brute-force counterbalance to a bad mechanical situation. The chain should be able to run smoothly even without a good construction.


    Baby_Yoda
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 5,387
    Poor passengers, stranded on that thing all night. I smell a lawsuit!
    Baby_Yoda
  • blokey9blokey9 MelbourneMember Posts: 237
    Phantom107 said:
    I’ve been experimenting again, pushing the two sets more to the limit, I’ve used an additional sloped piece in the 2nd chainlift and used the increase in height to allow for some more track, there’s an elevated part in the right now. It does slow the cars down considerably, but they still make it to the end.


    i think your problem is that you are using the Saturn V rocket to power the rollercoaster.
    Baby_Yoda7BSsid3windrMuftak1mustang69SumoLegokiki180703
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    edited September 2018
    Hey peoples, project is still going on, thinking about ways to redesign the thing so I can:
    A - use more pieces of track
    B - don't run into issues running out of white round pieces when going up so tall

    I have to use the dual-columns approach with the chainlifts or I run into major stability issues
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 15,197
    Astrobricks said:
    Poor passengers, stranded on that thing all night. I smell a lawsuit!
    Here's my card... one for you as well, please pass them to the riders in the back.  Thank you.
    blokey9 said:
    i think your problem is that you are using the Saturn V rocket to power the rollercoaster.
    That's a solution, not a problem.  And awesome.
    gmonkey76stluxSwitchfoot55kiki180703Mynattsid3windr
  • PapaBearPapaBear East CoastMember Posts: 611
    I moved mine to a different location.  Just need to set the time aside to build everything.
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    I'm building and iterating on a new prototype, this time with a dual chainlink so I can make the track go way longer, I'm trying to use up as much of the track pieces as I can; since the chainlifts will be alongside each other I hope to save a lot of white round bricks there too.

    The current prototype being worked out in LEGOs and in 3D:





  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    edited September 2018
    Completed the full loop with only 2 track pieces left over:



    Video is now up:

    https://youtu.be/FOzmEZBWiGE
    sid3windrRonyarSwitchfoot55kiki180703stlux
  • CoasterDynamixCoasterDynamix ElktonMember Posts: 12
    I don't want to hijack an older thread, but I'm fascinated and excited with all the experimentation going on with this set. My question is: has anyone run the coaster over a long period of time? I have heard it slows down over time (our models do too so I'm not trying to be critical). I ask because we are thinking of coming out with metal wheel sets for the Lego coaster and I am looking for some people who may want to do some testing. Thanks!
    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    CoasterDynamix said:
    I don't want to hijack an older thread, but I'm fascinated and excited with all the experimentation going on with this set. My question is: has anyone run the coaster over a long period of time? I have heard it slows down over time (our models do too so I'm not trying to be critical). I ask because we are thinking of coming out with metal wheel sets for the Lego coaster and I am looking for some people who may want to do some testing. Thanks!

    Guess I'll find out if it slows down eventually, haven't had time for a while to develop on this project due to work. I did get some 2nd hand sets that I always wanted but couldn't afford during my childhood, I am playing a bit with those (and loving it) to get a feel so I can get some actual themeing going on for the rollercoaster. I got 2x #6090 and 1x #6086 
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    What I was trying was much too ambitious, couldnt get it right and eventually lost interest and got into building some Lego castles.

    I’m back into it now and want to try something on a smaller scope that’s actually doable. I found this amazing idea: https://zusammengebaut.com/das-ist-der-perfekte-lego-achterbahn-looping-60588/

    I’m gonna try to do the same thing with the loop, this looks really cool and this looks like it’s feasible. I got 2 sets of the rollercoaster to play with and limited space so this might work out!
    AstrobricksMuftak1LittleLorikiki180703sid3windr
  • im2cre8ivim2cre8iv Utah, USAMember Posts: 166
    Love to see activity in this thread - and think the sideways track loop idea is ingenious. Thanks for the updates!
    BastyPhantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Very unstable, this connection is tough to make, but very cool nonetheless.

    Gonna figure out how the track should go, then probably re-build the entire thing or something. But very much in line with the original Lego design so I can actually finish it.

    Testing:



    Slo mo test

    https://youtu.be/qFXbHtKL8rI
    MCNwakeboardstluxim2cre8ivsid3windr
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    Designed a new concept in 3D, takes into account a bunch of mistakes I made last time, I'm gonna (badly) put some track in place again then see what happens.

    Takes the original LEGO design (which is VERY good I might add, after all my testing and experiments) at heart for the core part as well as the new part, this makes it a lot more feasable too. 




    mustang69
  • autolycusautolycus US-SEMember Posts: 1,390
    Is it going to be able to make that last little rise before the boarding platform?

    And am I understanding the loop correctly that the car will actually be riding on the outside edges of a pair of track pieces rather on a single piece? Interesting concept. Have you tested that at all?
    Phantom107
  • MCNwakeboardMCNwakeboard UtahMember Posts: 320
    Is there a lot of stress on the tracks/bricks using that loop? 
    Phantom107
  • Phantom107Phantom107 The NetherlandsMember Posts: 73
    edited April 2019
    @autolycus

    Probably won't make it to the end but there's options left to not have to.

    I'm trying to copy and improve on this idea: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-oidjJxI02w


    @MCNwakeboard

    I put more clips inside the loop so the stress is much more distributed so it's actually not a problem now in the loop itself, but I do have to put some stress on it to keep the pieces straight that connect to the rest of the track. But I don't think its so bad that I shouldn't do it. But bending it a bit is probably considered an illegal building practice...


  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 5,387
    autolycus said:

    And am I understanding the loop correctly that the car will actually be riding on the outside edges of a pair of track pieces rather on a single piece? Interesting concept. Have you tested that at all?
    Watch the videos.
    im2cre8ivPhantom107
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 5,387
    ^ Nice. It would preserve even more momentum if you could prevent the rocking of the loop as the train goes through it.
    Phantom107
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