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Early release for Saturn v...

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  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 4,504
    edited June 2017
    ^ OTOH, due to resellers, more people who want the set after it retires are able to buy it. Although, I admit, I'm not really thinking about the shelf-clearing type of reseller.
  • Bosstone100Bosstone100 USAMember Posts: 1,434
    ^ or would the set still be available if the resellers didn't buy them, even if it was retired. That panic to buy sets before they disappear should take care of that.

    The number of sets purchased for resale doesn't change the number of people who want the set or will want the set but it will decrease the number of people who can get them at retail. Buying sets for resale only moves the sets from the category of "purchased at retail" to "purchased in the aftermarket above retail." So, the only difference is the jacked up prices.
    Jern92omniumcatwrangler
  • OnebricktoomanyOnebricktoomany United StatesMember Posts: 299
    ^????How long should Lego produce the set?  How many sets should they make?  What should the price be?  How much time should be given to everyone to purchase the set?  How many sets should I be able to purchase?  I'm not a reseller but I do purchase sometimes three or four or five sets.  For Any number of reasons... my kids, nieces and nephews, to build a bigger set(Spider-Man bridge) etc... Resellers don't bother me.  I know, off topic. My apologies.
  • Bosstone100Bosstone100 USAMember Posts: 1,434
    ^ I thought of doing the same thing with the bridges. Using a set is different from buying one for resale that could go to someone who just wants one to build.

     It's just silly that resellers are thinking that they are doing people a favor.
    OnebricktoomanyJern92
  • datsunrobbiedatsunrobbie West Haven , CTMember Posts: 1,698
    Those of us who want it will likely still be able to buy it, we just have to wait for the next production run. If Toywiz or one of the other scalpers buys all those before I get one, then I'll just wait for it to show up at the thrift store. Resellers like the folks with Bricklink stores are certainly providing a great service to people looking for retired sets. Scalpers like Toywiz, who buy up all available stock on day one and try to flip it immediately, are in my opinion a slightly lower form of life than the corporate owners of LEPIN.
    OnebricktoomanyAstrobricksgmonkey76FollowsClosely
  • OnebricktoomanyOnebricktoomany United StatesMember Posts: 299
    ^Agree with you on THAT type of reseller.  The person buying 5 sets doesn't bug me.
    Astrobricks
  • datsunrobbiedatsunrobbie West Haven , CTMember Posts: 1,698
    I have not done any reselling, but have certainly bought multiples of sets on sale. When brick-and-mortar stores are selling older sets at deep discounts, I'll clear out the shelf. After all, those sets have been sitting there, other folks had opportunity to buy them at retail before I walked up to the shelf.

    A good reseller might get an extra copy or two of the Saturn V and try to resell to cover costs on they one they bought to build. A scalper is somebody like the one in this ebay auction https://www.ebay.com/i/352077247640?chn=ps&dispItem=1, who already sold 89 of them as I'm posting this. That one auction probably explains why they are scarce around Niagara Falls.
    pharmjod
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Chicagoland USMember Posts: 10,155
    I just read a comment about resellers and I have to say that if resellers didn't buy product to resell, more people who actually wanted the set with be able to buy it.
    That is also flawed logic IMO. You are assuming that without the demand that LEGO would make as much as they made initially and these would just be sitting there waiting for someone to buy it. The assumption is that resellers bought massive amounts of these to try to resell. In reality, the number bought for resale in comparison to those who wanted to buy the set to actually display/play with, is likely infinitesimal. This also likely means that maybe, maybe, another day or two before LEGO ran out of stock. So that also likely means that people griping about missing out on one would likely still be griping about missing out on one. Never mind the fact that LEGO, at any time, could impose a limit and actually enforce it. Amazon has proven this can be done. So what is LEGO's excuse?
    I say likely because really it is anyone's guess, but more probable that evil resellers buying 3/4s of the stock of these in their initial run.
  • typocorrectotypocorrecto Member Posts: 196
    Just bought a set from Target. Seems to be going in and out of stock.
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    I just read a comment about resellers and I have to say that if resellers didn't buy product to resell, more people who actually wanted the set with be able to buy it.
    It's a double-edged sword. Imagine every single person who buys a new set all opened them to play, there would not be any MIB sets available for others to buy down the road when the product goes EOL. 

    Resellers are the ones who provided this service to people who wanted to get products released years ago else we can never dream of owning this or that vintage set in mint condition. 

    As for the price, I do believe it is market driven, they can only sell it as high as people wanted to pay for it. This also applies to TLG's current products as well, they priced it differently in different countries (some high, some low) as much as they think those markets can bear. 




  • LegoboyLegoboy 100km furtherMember Posts: 8,831
    Recce said:
    I just read a comment about resellers and I have to say that if resellers didn't buy product to resell, more people who actually wanted the set with be able to buy it.
    Resellers are the ones who provided this service to people who wanted to get products released years ago else we can never dream of owning this or that vintage set in mint condition. 

    Most resellers aren't providing that service though.  In my early years I was thankful for the resellers that provided that service but for the majority it's about a quick turnaround having cleared the shelves on heavy discount days.  Its about those that buy up a newly released item and hold them to ransom ie. Minecraft, 4x4 Crawler and for me it's just not in the spirit of being a lego fan.
    omniumcheshirecatcatwrangler
  • omniumomnium Brickenham, UKMember Posts: 831
    edited June 2017
    I think the conclusion I'm reading here is that there are good and bad types of resellers.

    I agree that if a set is sat on shelves on discount because they aren't selling, then if someone snaps them all up and resells them at a premium some time later, they probably haven't upset anyone.

    If someone buys an extra set or two to keep and sell on later, that is probably fine too.

    But the sort of people who buy up as much stock of a newly released product and deprive people of the opportunity to buy it at retail are never going to be popular.

    With the Saturn V as an example, I'd like two copies. I bought and built one immediately. I could have bought two (or 5!), but I had a feeling it would run out, and I would be depriving other people of the set.

    I'll wait till the set is back in normal stock, if it ever is, then I'll buy a second. That's what I did with the Exo-Suit. Then, it went on sale a few times and I eventually bought a 3rd and then a 4th. I've built them all for a photo project, by the way. Now I'm wishing I bought a 5th and 6th :-)
    catwranglersnowhitie
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    @omnium I can sell you a 5th or 6th copy of the exosuit if you are so inclined.
    SumoLegoFollowsClosely
  • BeximusBeximus Member Posts: 10
    If you're in the UK, John Lewis appears to have some stock available online - I bought one this morning.
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    Out of all the Ideas sets, I think the EXO Suit seems to have an abundance of overstock. 

    I'm wondering how is the sales figure like when compared to other Ideas sets. 
  • supervir2supervir2 united statesMember Posts: 25
    Having read through a few pages, the consensus seems to be that this will be back in stock?  Normally, I wait for double points on sets like this, but knowing that ideas sets sometimes sell out I purchased this day one.  I'd like to get double points for the Old Fishing Store, but am waffling on waiting vs buying day one again.
  • sid3windrsid3windr BelgiumMember Posts: 1,457
    No way a not purposefully limited release (a la #41999) will ever sell out on day one...
  • PmhPmh netherlandsMember Posts: 128
    It should be here tomorrow,ordered on the 1st of june. I Am so happy to finally get this set,can not wait to build it!.
    madforLEGO
  • omniumomnium Brickenham, UKMember Posts: 831
    pharmjod said:
    @omnium I can sell you a 5th or 6th copy of the exosuit if you are so inclined.

    Thanks! Importing to UK doesn't seem wise. I have most of the parts needed to make another and can probably bricklink the remainder for yet another quite cheaply. They'll be broken down once I'm finished anyway.
  • BeximusBeximus Member Posts: 10
    The one I've had on backorder with Lego was shipped yesterday, so it seems that there's more stock coming through the system.  Still says out of stock on the site though.
  • Speedman29Speedman29 UKMember Posts: 1,969
    I've now gone from meh, not too fussed, to checking [email protected] three times every day waiting for it to come back in stock!
  • stluxstlux LuxembourgMember Posts: 2,416
    Now also available (in stock both in store and online) from TRU in both France and Germany. Couldn't find it on the sites of their other European stores.
  • JudgeChuckJudgeChuck UKMember Posts: 1,472
    I've only had time to build Stage 1 of the rocket so far and have really enjoyed it. It's massive already! ;-)

    One question though: There are a number of small-ish sub-assemblies on 2x6 plates, that clip onto bars inside the rocket, about half-way up the stage, but these seem to "stick out" a bit along either edge. I've tried putting them in different ways round, but the edge of the 241201 White 1x2 Radiator Grilles juts out slightly, which mars the finish. Has anyone else had issues with this? Do I just need to fiddle around with them a bit more to get them to sit better? Any hints?
  • Brickfan50Brickfan50 Zwolle, NetherlandsMember Posts: 338
    ^ Had the same issues as you. When I find time I will try to rebuild this stage from scratch to see if I can make it better. I think fiddling is the right word here. :-)
  • FollowsCloselyFollowsClosely Member Posts: 1,035
    omnium said:
    ...Now I'm wishing I bought a 5th and 6th :-)
    I have a few 100 if you are interested :)
  • Bosstone100Bosstone100 USAMember Posts: 1,434
    @madforLEGO - not flawed logic at all. X sets available for only x people. Resellers buy some sets. Now only people with extra money can buy those sets. There are still only x sets available. It's only flawed logic to you because it supports your behavior.  
    Jern92
  • monkeyhangermonkeyhanger Member Posts: 3,013
    I've only had time to build Stage 1 of the rocket so far and have really enjoyed it. It's massive already! ;-)

    One question though: There are a number of small-ish sub-assemblies on 2x6 plates, that clip onto bars inside the rocket, about half-way up the stage, but these seem to "stick out" a bit along either edge. I've tried putting them in different ways round, but the edge of the 241201 White 1x2 Radiator Grilles juts out slightly, which mars the finish. Has anyone else had issues with this? Do I just need to fiddle around with them a bit more to get them to sit better? Any hints?

    I have this on mine, and spent a bit of time seeing if it could be prevented, I couldn't find a way, we're talking about 1/5 of a plate's width it sticks out by. I have accepted it.
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 2,106
    All this talk of resellers, if resellers buy a lot to start with Lego might make more sets, do another production run. So there might end up being more sets made which lowers the resale price. A good example might be the exosuit which got a second production run because of good early sales and then ended up being sold at a discount.
  • LegoboyLegoboy 100km furtherMember Posts: 8,831
    ^ Lego can only do another 'production run' if the agreement or license allows it, if such exists.  Who says tbe Exo second run was due to initial sales?  Maybe it was always forecast.  Despite what LEGO might brag about, I find it difficult to believe they can simply 'do another production run' at the drop of a hat.  It needs to be forecast months in advance.  Materials, parts, box manufacture, manual printing etc etc.

    What i find incredible is that it's worth someone's while going to the effort and risk of banking themselves 20 squid by securing an early Saturn to flog.  I mean, get a life.  Really.
    MAGNINOMINISUMBRAgmonkey76SumoLegoJern92
  • MAGNINOMINISUMBRAMAGNINOMINISUMBRA Member Posts: 993
    Take it as you will but a little bird told me the size of the Exosuit production run was determined by one single thing - the amount of green air tanks that were required to be produced to justify the part run.
    Legoboy said:
    SNIP
    Despite what LEGO might brag about, I find it difficult to believe they can simply 'do another production run' at the drop of a hat.  It needs to be forecast months in advance.  Materials, parts, box manufacture, manual printing etc etc.
    SNIP
    Correct - As soon as the factory test model was complete TLG knew they had an absolute winner that was going to appeal to possibly the broadest range of collectors any set ever has (outside of some of their licensed lines). The Saturn  is going to be around for a LONG time and TLG have forecast runs accordingly.  
    Legoboy said:
    SNIP
    What i find incredible is that it's worth someone's while going to the effort and risk of banking themselves 20 squid by securing an early Saturn to flog.  I mean, get a life.  Really.
    It no longer surprises me in the slightest.  The amount of resellers now happy to work at 'cents in the dollar' margins is ludicrous.  As I've stated elsewhere, I'm still of the belief that a LOT of resellers must be accessing pricing structures that I'm unable to, or for that matter, work out EXACTLY how they are.
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Chicagoland USMember Posts: 10,155
    @madforLEGO - not flawed logic at all. X sets available for only x people. Resellers buy some sets. Now only people with extra money can buy those sets. There are still only x sets available. It's only flawed logic to you because it supports your behavior.  
    My behavior? I bought ONE of these because I wanted the set, but I knew they were going to be in demand. I also had enough forethought to buy mine immediately when it came out.

    Fair enough, you logic is awesome. In fact, you should also point fingers at anyone that bought more than one. They must be resellers right? Could not be a collector that wanted one to open and one to keep sealed, right? What if they bought one as a gift? It was not for them, so heck they must be stopped as well. You are solely saying that because of resellers this is happening where people are going to miss a set?

    At the end of the day LEGO could stop most resellers in their tracks by making a limit and enforcing it. So you say 'if not for resellers...' I say if LEGO (ie the true source of product, not resellers) would actually make and enforce a buy limit, then more would be available. However if LEGO strictly held everyone to 1, and had x number of sets to produce, someone likely will still miss out.. Though it is typically after a set run ends years later and they missed out on the production run. 'Ohh if LEGO just would have made 1000000, and 1, of that readily available set' ....Damn resellers.

    I sometimes wonder that LEGO does not enforce limits on limited sets because they would rather have people blast 'resellers' instead of LEGO enforcing a limit and then not making enough to satiate the masses.

    In any case, LEGO announced they are making more, so get your satisfaction that any short seller that bought these hoping to make a quick buck are now stuck with them. 
    Recce
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    edited June 2017
    Well I have managed to get 3 and could have ordered way more from the initial Wal-Mart release. I've sold two easily for a net profit of $59. That makes the current one I am keeping for myself $68 or so which is 46% off a set that will never be 46% off legitimately. That's why I resell. Cheap or free LEGO for me. I enjoy the labor so I don't really count my time as a per hour function
    CCC
  • Bosstone100Bosstone100 USAMember Posts: 1,434
    @madforLEGO - you are making a lot of assumptions. Just saying that resellers aren't doing people favors. They are buying stock that regular buyers could buy at retail to charge those who have extra money to spend get the sets instead of those who are only able or willing to buy at retail. That's all I'm saying.
  • MAGNINOMINISUMBRAMAGNINOMINISUMBRA Member Posts: 993
    Just playing devils advocate, but ANYONE who thinks that TLG can effectively enforce buying limits outside of their own website and (to a lesser extent) their own brand stores, is living in Dreamland!  The minute the container leaves the factory, the Genie has well and truly escaped the bottle.
      If you also take into account the number of people who skirt customer limits with multiple purchasing accounts or in person, 'revolving door' purchasing, the expectation of ANY sort of sale limits is ludicrous.
      The only reason TLG even impose sales limits is to provide the APPEARANCE of customer service.
    Johnyk668
  • ecmo47ecmo47 North CarolinaMember Posts: 2,101
    ^If you want to get pissed off at somebody, blame the buyers. If there were no buyers  fools (willing to pay the marked up price) there would be no re-sellers.

    And yes, resellers ARE doing consumers a favor. They are providing availability to those that would rather fork over the cash rather then wait patient for supply to catch up with demand (in the case of a new release) and 2: they provide availability when the production run is done. 

    Now, in the words of Johnny Storm........ 
    MAGNINOMINISUMBRACCCdatsunrobbieRecce
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Chicagoland USMember Posts: 10,155
    edited June 2017
    Obviously if other retailers are selling then, yes, it is up to each retailer to limit and LEGO cannot control that, but they CAN control it when they have items like exclusives or other limited sets that they sell. The argument being if LEGO has a note that says 'limit 2' then they should enforce it, otherwise just remove it and let someone buy 50 if they want. As for anyone saying that cannot be done. Well, I think Amazon would beg to differ when they suspend, or outright ban and remove accounts of, people for trying to circumvent the limits they impost. Now, does that stop ALL resellers? Obviously not, there are ways around it, but typically it takes multiple accounts from differing households, and not in the same household (as some have attested when they tried to circumvent Amazon's limits by using a different card, or making multiple purchases). So it CAN be done to at least take steps to reduce binge buying. (and yes I get that stores do not like to do it as they could get stuck with merchandise they may have sold sooner than later, but again if that is the case remove the limit notices that you do not enforce anyway)

    Just saying, if LEGO, TRU, or anyone says 'limit 1' or 'limit 2' for making purchases, then they should take step to enforce that, OR just remove the limits as they are a joke if not enforced.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    @madforLEGO - you are making a lot of assumptions. Just saying that resellers aren't doing people favors. They are buying stock that regular buyers could buy at retail to charge those who have extra money to spend get the sets instead of those who are only able or willing to buy at retail. That's all I'm saying.
    If there is limited stock, and there are more potential buyers than items, then resellers are doing some of those buyers a favour. They remove stock from the hands of people that are willing to pay up to RRP, and allow the other (possibly slower) buyers that want the set and are willing to pay more than RRP to buy it. Obviously cashing in themselves too. Sure, some are not able to buy it due to the reseller, but others are because of the reseller. If they are all eventually sold by the reseller (and no reseller wants to retain stock forever), the end result is the same as if the reseller didn't exist - every set is in the hands of a buyer that wanted it. Some people that wanted it will go without, but that would have always been the case if production was limited. The existence of the reseller just means that the people that went without are different to the ones that would have gone without if the reseller didn't exist.

    This happens a lot with the top toys before Xmas (remember the first Minecraft set?) Many of those that bought the Minecraft set from resellers at inflated price for their kid's Xmas present wouldn't have been able to buy it from a retail store, even if the reseller hadn't purchased them. Other parents would have bought them instead and given them to their kids, so that stock wouldn't have been available at the time. So the ones willing to pay more for it have been done a favour by the reseller (obviously not an altruistic favour though).

    The other people that benefit from resellers (ones that ship internationally) are people that live in countries where the set is not for sale. 


    sid3windrmadforLEGORecce
  • UberbrickUberbrick OregonMember Posts: 83
    edited June 2017
    I just called my local Lego store, and they told me they'd be restocking it sometime in July…
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,228
    Legoboy said:
    Despite what LEGO might brag about, I find it difficult to believe they can simply 'do another production run' at the drop of a hat. 
    I believe the production schedules are set a minimum of eighteen months in advance.  My best recollection was that after the initial run of Friends Dolphin Cruisers (which doesn't mean they are all produced at once, or released all at once), it took about that long for stock in meaningful volume to arrive.   And this is the Lego Retail Store channel.

    Nobody knows if/when TRU finds and releases a palette of product in their inefficient distribution network.

  • tbeattbeat Northern Ireland Member Posts: 7
    I got a shipping notification today, after ordering on release day, stock may be starting to move again!
  • CommanderJigglypuffCommanderJigglypuff NetherlandsMember Posts: 63
    From what I've been told by a Lego licensed store here in Holland (not a Official Lego Store, but as close as you can get) the Saturn V will be in and out of stock until at least October. In nearly 99% the previous sets that had the same problem they were right with the estimated time, so if you want one here asap you should probably buy it as soon when it comes back in stock again. 
  • HugeYellowBrickHugeYellowBrick At my PCMember Posts: 496
    Mine's arrived! Ordered in the evening of June 1st on Lego Shop online (UK).
  • Bosstone100Bosstone100 USAMember Posts: 1,434
    @ecmo47- who is pissed?
    MAGNINOMINISUMBRA
  • ThoughtsonblocksThoughtsonblocks United StatesMember Posts: 178
    I have been checking Barnes and Nobles website pretty much daily to see if they had gotten more available in store, noticed today you could order online again (previously it had just been grayed out with an "out of stock" warning).  Placed my order with delivery set for the 6th!  Now to just figure out my 10% off I was supposed to get as a member....  Discount didnt show up in the cart, but didnt want to wait and risk losing it, so made the purchase anyway.
  • bluedragonbluedragon United StatesMember Posts: 505
    ^B&N 10% discount is in store only AFAIK
  • MegtheCatMegtheCat Houston, TXMember Posts: 500
    ^^Yes, it's in store only. I've ordered from them often when I get coupons in the mail.

    Hopefully you at least got the free member shipping?
  • typocorrectotypocorrecto Member Posts: 196
    In stock at Target right now.
  • AstrobricksAstrobricks Minnesota, USMember Posts: 4,504
    Target.com, I assume?
  • pookiepookie Member Posts: 156
    Gone
  • typocorrectotypocorrecto Member Posts: 196
    edited July 2017
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