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LEGO fight Against Chinese counterfeit LEGO

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Comments

  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    @Pitfall69 and @ericb: Just for the record, I didn't defend my decision to try out Lepin products. Neither do I care whether you care about it or not. As long as I buy Lego Sets all the time and Lepin three times in my life, I don't see any reason to care myself.

  • MaffyDMaffyD West YorkshireMember Posts: 3,027
    I just keep wondering "Would it be ok if I bought a set I already had?" Coz MF really. It's a rhetorical question really, but it keeps popping into my head as I read this thread. Then goes away again after...
  • TigerMothTigerMoth Member Posts: 2,343
    MaffyD said:
    I just keep wondering "Would it be ok if I bought a set I already had?" Coz MF really. It's a rhetorical question really, but it keeps popping into my head as I read this thread. Then goes away again after...
    There are apparently people who buy LEGO modulars to keep and the same LEPIN modulars to make and gather dust.
    Jern92
  • Pitfall69Pitfall69 0 miles to Legoboy's houseMember Posts: 11,444
    @Pitfall69 and @ericb: Just for the record, I didn't defend my decision to try out Lepin products. Neither do I care whether you care about it or not. As long as I buy Lego Sets all the time and Lepin three times in my life, I don't see any reason to care myself.

    ...and I don't care if you care that I care or not. I couldn't care less. I can do this all night ;)

    BTW, I am just messing with you. Remember,  the ;) makes it all better :)
    SumoLegopharmjodTheMaker37
  • Pitfall69Pitfall69 0 miles to Legoboy's houseMember Posts: 11,444
    TigerMoth said:
    MaffyD said:
    I just keep wondering "Would it be ok if I bought a set I already had?" Coz MF really. It's a rhetorical question really, but it keeps popping into my head as I read this thread. Then goes away again after...
    There are apparently people who buy LEGO modulars to keep and the same LEPIN modulars to make and gather dust.
    I have no doubt that is what people do. 
    pharmjod
  • dougtsdougts Oregon, USAMember Posts: 4,129
    TigerMoth said:
    MaffyD said:
    I just keep wondering "Would it be ok if I bought a set I already had?" Coz MF really. It's a rhetorical question really, but it keeps popping into my head as I read this thread. Then goes away again after...
    There are apparently people who buy LEGO modulars to keep and the same LEPIN modulars to make and gather dust.
    this actually makes a lot of sense
    Pitfall69SumoLegopharmjod
  • Pitfall69Pitfall69 0 miles to Legoboy's houseMember Posts: 11,444
    ^If I wasn't so against buying LEPIN, I would do the same thing.
    pharmjodSumoLego
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,229
    ^ I'm pro-dust elsewhere, so I could care less if you care less about a dust-less, care-free, care-less environment, elsewhere.

    Who cares?
    LegogramTheMaker37AustinPowers
  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    SumoLego said:
    ^ I'm pro-dust elsewhere, so I could care less if you care less about a dust-less, care-free, care-less environment, elsewhere.

    Who cares?
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjoqY9EtMmI
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    TigerMoth said:
    There are apparently people who buy LEGO modulars to keep and the same LEPIN modulars to make and gather dust.
    This is why I would consider buying them.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    It's a strange thing to do. If they are inferior, why build an inferior model but pay more than the original (as you buy both) for a worse build experience. If they are an acceptable alternative, then surely there is not so much long term value in the original as others will think that too.
    monkeyhanger
  • LunchieteyLunchietey Australia Member Posts: 24
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
  • brumeybrumey AustriaMember Posts: 1,002
    i ll give ordering from ali another try.


    this pretty dragon caught my attention
  • Scott1Scott1 United StatesMember Posts: 48

    I think the only reason why Lepin makes as much money as it does is because of its modulars. Even if you go to the eBay "Sold Listings" tab then you'll see that modulars are every other sold item. Personally I think Lego should re-release Market Street (and, over time, the other modulars) while still introducing a new one each year. Not only will that crack down on speculators, but it will also give new AFOL's like me a chance to get some of the older sets at reasonable prices. 

    CaptainPirateMan
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.
    monkeyhangerTheBigLegoski
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    CCC said:
    It's a strange thing to do. If they are inferior, why build an inferior model but pay more than the original (as you buy both) for a worse build experience. If they are an acceptable alternative, then surely there is not so much long term value in the original as others will think that too.
    They re not inferior, just think of it as paying a small fee to get the chance to own, build and play with it.
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    Scott1 said:

    I think the only reason why Lepin makes as much money as it does is because of its modulars. Even if you go to the eBay "Sold Listings" tab then you'll see that modulars are every other sold item. Personally I think Lego should re-release Market Street (and, over time, the other modulars) while still introducing a new one each year. Not only will that crack down on speculators, but it will also give new AFOL's like me a chance to get some of the older sets at reasonable prices. 

    I believe it has been discussed before, i.e. like all other companies TLG does not have unlimited resource, they have new annual inhouse products, licensed theme products etc that need to get released quarterly.

    Their core target audience (>90% of buyers) is children and parents, they may not have the resource to reproduce EOL sets specifically just to cater for the single digit percentage AFOL market so it is not a good business decision.
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    One point worth noting is that this court case could just be an action triggered to pacify the AFOL community so when people ask TLG they could at least have a response.

    In other words, TLG probably is prepared to fight a loosing battle.
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    CCC said:
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.
    This had me thinking, if say someone is willing to pay $10K for a Lego Cafe Corner in 10 years time, there might actually be someone else willing to pay $1K or $2K for a Lepin version.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    Recce said:
    CCC said:
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.
    This had me thinking, if say someone is willing to pay $10K for a Lego Cafe Corner in 10 years time, there might actually be someone else willing to pay $1K or $2K for a Lepin version.
    Not if Lepin, or another company, are still making "Corner Cafe" or similar.
    TheBigLegoski
  • monkeyhangermonkeyhanger Member Posts: 3,013
    CCC said:
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.

    I was about to type something similar.

    I think that this Lepin business is as big a threat to resellers as to Lego themselves. If Lepin can make just as good a product of a retired UCS/Modular set as Lego did, who is going to pay £4k for a genuine MF 10179 when the Lepin version is about £150 delivered? I'm sure that many people would baulk at £500 for an official re-release by Lego when the Lepin equivalent is accessible and has acceptable quality standards.

    People will start questioning why they are paying so much for Lego when Lepin may be perceived as just as good.

    Imagine comparing a £30k new car to a £10k new car, and the £10k car provides the same driving experience, same tech, feels just as solid, just as quick and economical...do you start wondering whether that badge is worth an extra £20k?

    Of course Lego's operation costs a lot more to run than Lepin's - many people don't care about that, they just see the sticker price.

    As an AFOL, I am reassured that the premium I am paying for a Lego UCS set is reflected in the fact that if I ever give the hobby up, i'll get my money back (and probably a modest profit)...now i'm getting less sure. Will people pay £400 for my UCS Imperial shuttle that has been built once and displayed, with the box and manual in perfect condition if Lepin has a perfectly good copy that has the same fit and clutch power as the Lego equivalent (and perhaps less colour variation between the white parts).

    People pay a premium for a premium product, not sure if they'll bother paying 3x more for the same quality (or perceived same quality).
    raygunn
  • TigerMothTigerMoth Member Posts: 2,343
    Recce said:
    Scott1 said:

    I think the only reason why Lepin makes as much money as it does is because of its modulars. Even if you go to the eBay "Sold Listings" tab then you'll see that modulars are every other sold item. Personally I think Lego should re-release Market Street (and, over time, the other modulars) while still introducing a new one each year. Not only will that crack down on speculators, but it will also give new AFOL's like me a chance to get some of the older sets at reasonable prices. 

    I believe it has been discussed before, i.e. like all other companies TLG does not have unlimited resource, they have new annual inhouse products, licensed theme products etc that need to get released quarterly.

    Their core target audience (>90% of buyers) is children and parents, they may not have the resource to reproduce EOL sets specifically just to cater for the single digit percentage AFOL market so it is not a good business decision.
    TLG could set up an identical company to LEPIN, with exactly the same facilities and costs - and profits. If it's worth it for LEPIN, it ought to be worth it for that new company.

    They don't because, whilst the Eastern attitude is that a profit is a profit, the Western one questions whether it's big enough to justify getting out of bed in the morning.
    monkeyhanger said:

    People pay a premium for a premium product, not sure if they'll bother paying 3x more for the same quality (or perceived same quality).
    When AFOLs are already asking that question, for non-AFOLs without the brand loyalty, it would be a no-brainer.
    dougtspharmjod
  • datsunrobbiedatsunrobbie West Haven , CTMember Posts: 1,698
    Lots of people worldwide are still buying Apple iPhones despite the availability of Android phones made by manufacturers like Huawei that can do 99% of what a current iPhone can do for substantially lower prices -  $650US for a new iPhone 7 vs $200 for a Huawei Honor 5X. $20 for a CoolPad Rogue (full price, not on a contract) for those who are okay with only 90% of the iPhone's capabilities. These alternatives don't seem to be slowing Apple down, and they only have about 20% of the market when measured by number of units sold. The secondary market for iPhones doesn't seem to be suffering either. 
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    I thought the iphone's market share was down recently. Although of course, a very different market. Lego has a massive market share in the building bricks market whereas apple doesn't in smart phones. Apple's fanboy reputation also derives from another market (computers), whereas Lego's doesn't.
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    I think there are always going to be people that will pay a premium for genuine Lego sets retired or otherwise. The problem for resellers is typically other resellers. A set may be desirable, but will take much longer to really appreciate due to the residual supply. It has been said before, a person that will buy a lepin green grocer for $90 was never going to spend $1000 on the LEGO version.
  • TigerMothTigerMoth Member Posts: 2,343
    CCC said:
    Apple's fanboy reputation also derives from another market (compoluters), whereas Lego's doesn't.
    Part of the attraction to Apple is that of a status symbol - which is why they try to ensure nothing else looks like their products. Two almost-identical Millenium Falcon's on display, where you can only tell the difference by getting out a magnifying glass and examining the studs, don't benefit from that. With Apple, the logo itself has some value; the logo on a toy, or even a prestigious model, means an awful lot less.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    pharmjod said:
    I think there are always going to be people that will pay a premium for genuine Lego sets retired or otherwise. The problem for resellers is typically other resellers. A set may be desirable, but will take much longer to really appreciate due to the residual supply. It has been said before, a person that will buy a lepin green grocer for $90 was never going to spend $1000 on the LEGO version.
    I agree. But if many brick fans are happy enough with knock offs, but buying originals for resale, then it isn't sustainable. There will be too many on the secondary market with only "niche" buyers tgat want originals. My reselling mantra is buy stuff I like, as others will probably like it too. 


    pharmjod
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    It's interesting to compare Apple with TLG. Apple is no longer a monopoly whereas TLG still is in terms of the toy bricks market. 

    The first few years of the iphone we saw lots of copycats appearing with Apple launching lawsuits left and right. Thank god that didn't stop the advancement of technological innovations and now we have products from other companies that have better features and at cheaper prices, can't imagine what the world would be like if Apple was able to stop all copycats and remain a monopoly till today, l'd imagine the Apple tax would be astronomical, not that it isn't now (with competitors no less). 

    The Lego tax situation is exactly same as the Apple tax. Even the fan boy behaviours are the same, countless times I've seen and heard people saying "I would never buy a product just because it is not Apple", and blindly disregard logical thinkings of features and price point benefits. A fan boy is a fan boy after all, regardless of which company they worship. 

    No one doubted the efforts of innovators, engineers and designers that throughout the years come out with ideas and brilliantly designed products as they have every right to be monetarily compensated, but when the company is making billions of dollars out of those products you had to wonder how much they really overcharged on the products and when will the monopoly ends. It's a good thing there is a time limit for copyright holders, else they would be earning billions or even trillions till eternity.

    And you know what? The sad truth out of all these is that most if not all of the money are pocketed by the company's top executives with close to nothing left for the actual designers, except the basic salary. 
    dougtsJern92
  • RecceRecce Tiny Little Red DotMember Posts: 923
    CCC said:
    Recce said:
    CCC said:
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.
    This had me thinking, if say someone is willing to pay $10K for a Lego Cafe Corner in 10 years time, there might actually be someone else willing to pay $1K or $2K for a Lepin version.
    Not if Lepin, or another company, are still making "Corner Cafe" or similar.
    I do believe the life span of Lepin modulars will be much much shorter than that of a Lego modular. Remember, Lepin is not as big as TLG or anywhere close at all, their tactic is probably to sell a particular modular for a short period of time and then move on. Thus it is possible 1 or 2 years from now they may just disappear from the market. 
  • nhyonenhyone Member Posts: 145
    edited September 2016
    Recce said:
    I do believe the life span of Lepin modulars will be much much shorter than that of a Lego modular. Remember, Lepin is not as big as TLG or anywhere close at all, their tactic is probably to sell a particular modular for a short period of time and then move on. Thus it is possible 1 or 2 years from now they may just disappear from the market. 
    You mean I could become a Lepin-reseller? :-O

    Their 1st-edition boxes (the current ones) might be collectors' item if they are forced to changed due to TLG's lawsuit. :-P

    As long as it sells, I doubt Lepin will discontinue the set. This is Lego's self-imposed rule, which I think they are changing too.

    I don't know if Lepin has the capacity to manufacture so many sets (20+ now?) simultaneously. Rather, I think they are producing maybe 5-10 per month (at full capacity) and then reproducing them in a few months time as needed.
  • Jern92Jern92 MalaysiaMember Posts: 845
    nhyone said:
    Recce said:
    I do believe the life span of Lepin modulars will be much much shorter than that of a Lego modular. Remember, Lepin is not as big as TLG or anywhere close at all, their tactic is probably to sell a particular modular for a short period of time and then move on. Thus it is possible 1 or 2 years from now they may just disappear from the market. 
    You mean I could become a Lepin-reseller? :-O

    Their 1st-edition boxes (the current ones) might be collectors' item if they are forced to changed due to TLG's lawsuit. :-P

    As long as it sells, I doubt Lepin will discontinue the set. This is Lego's self-imposed rule, which I think they are changing too.

    I don't know if Lepin has the capacity to manufacture so many sets (20+ now?) simultaneously. Rather, I think they are producing maybe 5-10 per month (at full capacity) and then reproducing them in a few months time as needed.
    Lepin has apparently stopped producing a few sets, such as the Helicarrier. It would be impossible for them to produce more and more sets at the same time, so I guess at some point, something has to give.
  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    Pitfall69 said:
    @Pitfall69 and @ericb: Just for the record, I didn't defend my decision to try out Lepin products. Neither do I care whether you care about it or not. As long as I buy Lego Sets all the time and Lepin three times in my life, I don't see any reason to care myself.

    ...and I don't care if you care that I care or not. I couldn't care less. I can do this all night ;)

    BTW, I am just messing with you. Remember,  the ;) makes it all better :)


    And I don't care that you don't care that I....

    No worries, I got it.

    ;-)

  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    CCC said:
    It's a strange thing to do. If they are inferior, why build an inferior model but pay more than the original (as you buy both) for a worse build experience. If they are an acceptable alternative, then surely there is not so much long term value in the original as others will think that too.


    Actually I would agree with @Lunchietey said to that.

    Plus, the two Lepin Models I built weren't really inferior at all, plus the building experience was as much fun as an original Lego Modular. Remember, we are not talking shitty quality galore here. Sure, there might be the odd faulty part, but that can and does happen with Lego also. Only difference being that the service level of Lego is so much higher when anything is amiss.

  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    edited September 2016
    Recce said:
    I believe it has been discussed before, i.e. like all other companies TLG does not have unlimited resource, they have new annual inhouse products, licensed theme products etc that need to get released quarterly.


    This I just don't get at all. When I was young, there was one Lego catalog a year. And sets were available for many years.

    Now there are two Lego catalogs a year, plus an endless array of exclusives, polybags, etc. that aren't even in the catalogs. Ever more models at an ever increasing pace. There are too many mediocre sets already, so why flood the market with so many new sets all the time? Why not bring out less but better models like it used to be?

    Any high quality brand should care about their product lines, and most, especially in the premium segment, do. As Lego is undoubtedly a premium toy, they should start doing the same. Does Rolex throw one model after the other on the market? Rolls Royce, Ferrari, Gucci, etc.? Sure, Lego is not a luxury brand, but price-wise they are moving in that direction. Lego models for several hundreds of Dollar/Euro/...? Unheard of in the past, a rare occurence even in recent years, but nowadays? The DS used to be the lone pinnacle of Lego pricing, followed far behind by sets in the 150-200 Dollar/Euro range max. Just look at [email protected] exclusives today: there are twelve sets currently above the 200 Euro limit (thirteen if you count the DS ultimate set), plus six at the 200 Dollar/Euro price point. And standard sets are getting more expensive every year, at a rate far higher than general inflation. What does that tell us? That Lego is moving ever further away from its former core customer base and into the premium/luxury realm. At the same time they are throwing more and more product at the customers. I think we have seen a similar thing happen in the past, which then resulted in the near collapse of TLG. Let's hope they are not moving too far in that direction again. Because this time, if they were, companies like Lepin at al would be there to take over the market for sure.

    And Lepin (current action by TLG notwithstanding) are improving their products at an alarming rate. Over at a German Lepin forum (that there now even exists such a thing speaks volumes to me!) they have reviews of Lepin sets and for example their latest Modular clone (Pet Shop) shows marked improvements in the areas where the quality of parts in the earlier Modulars left a bit to be desired - like baseplates and especially clear/transparent parts like window panes. If Lepin continues to improve at that rate, TLG will definitely need to win their legal battle or the future could look very grim indeed. I think they know that and it is the main reason why they have now taken action whereas before they didn't really seem to care about Lepin.

    TheBigLegoskicatwranglerRecce
  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    pharmjod said:
    I think there are always going to be people that will pay a premium for genuine Lego sets retired or otherwise. The problem for resellers is typically other resellers. A set may be desirable, but will take much longer to really appreciate due to the residual supply. It has been said before, a person that will buy a lepin green grocer for $90 was never going to spend $1000 on the LEGO version.

    Premium maybe, but not insane prices. GG is a perfect example. I have an ebay auction for a used Lego GG on watch, to see whether it get's sold at all. The seller is asking a 680 Euro starting price. The article keeps getting relisted for months now, as it doesn't sell. Small wonder to me. I mean I can understand that someone who still has a MISB GG could sell it to another reseller/speculator for 1K Euro hoping that he can resell it at an even higher price in the future. No sane AFOL who is just interested in building the thing would pay that much money for a MISB (or used) GG, unless he has unlimited funds and just doesn't care. But how many of those people are there?

    The person who buys a Lepin GG is usually someone like me. Who wants to build the thing and play with it with his kids. Unless it is someone of the category I mentioned above, no one with that goal would pay 1K for an original if the Lepin version gets him 99.5% accuracy at a fraction of the cost.

    TheBigLegoski
  • LunchieteyLunchietey Australia Member Posts: 24
    For anyone interested, the build of the SSD is half way through and I have to say, I'm not surprised Lego are suing.

    It's a very enjoyable build with so far only one slightly deformed part (minor edge deformation ) and no missing bits. 

    The only quality issues I can see is that the red colour seems a bit off and the press strength required varies between some parts (some are very tight, some just like lego and some a little loose but not to the point of falling apart without force). Some of the hinge pieces are loose too but seeing as they are used in top/bottom pairs in this build it doesn't matter.

    Also parts are grouped and bagged in their entirety(although they are done to make part locating as easy as you probably could without 400 bags) so it can be time consuming finding parts for each step. I'm not sure it's a big deal, does make it a slower build but almost more fun to me.

    You really could display this and no one would even notice the difference. 

    MF on order, seems the 10030 Star destroyer and the 10143 death star II are the latest copies to be released...seems they have been reading AFOL wish lists?


  • TigerMothTigerMoth Member Posts: 2,343
    Jern92 said:

    It would be impossible for them to produce more and more sets at the same time, so I guess at some point, something has to give.
    Any company needs the capacity to make what they can sell. It doesn't really matter whether that's more copies of the same sets, or many different sets.
    AustinPowers said:

    This I just don't get at all. When I was young, there was one Lego catalog a year. And sets were available for many years.

    Now there are two Lego catalogs a year, plus an endless array of exclusives, polybags, etc. that aren't even in the catalogs.

    Actually, some of that is down to faulty perception. Catalogues in 60s had a fair sprinkling of sets that were "new for autumn", the same as today, and they were still only available for a relatively short period. Think about it - for the small number of years when you were a child, there was something "new" every year, and each time something else disappeared. It didn't seem like it because, if it was something that really interested you, it was something you had, so when it disappeared from the catalogue, it didn't disappear from your collection.
    There are too many mediocre sets already, so why flood the market with so many new sets all the time? Why not bring out less but better models like it used to be?
    Each theme is almost a separate product, appealing to a different set of children. Each has to have its own new sets all the time - look at the fuss over the re-release of the Toy Shop, a very limited theme that was still expected to have a new set. Things like polybags are there to encourage cross-over. There's also more money to be spent on toys, and more competition, so the ranges have to suit a wider variety of pockets.

    Also, children don't see things the same way as we do. Most are only interested in certain themes - they have to be because, one way or another their budgets are limited. Adults aren't so constrained in terms of the sets that may be considered, and their budgets, whilst sometimes limited, are more flexible.
    That Lego is moving ever further away from its former core customer base and into the premium/luxury realm.
    Kids think of the company as "LEGO". It comes with the impression of being squeaky-clean and wholesome. Around here some of us talk about TLG, and those who don't still understand the distinction. It's not so soft and fluffy, but that "L" still stands for "LEGO", so some of it rubs off.

    Who's heard of KIRKBI? It's TLG's parent. There's the same old stuff about quality and caring - but you take it with the same pinch of salt as you do for other companies once you start reading about investments in equities, property portfolios and subsidiaries in tax havens. That's not to say there's anything wrong, but it is all an indication that we're just talking about a company like any other. Companies generally follow the money, so perhaps we should back off from the fluffy stuff?
    catwranglermaaaaaaa
  • XefanXefan Member Posts: 1,149
    The only quality issues I can see is that the red colour seems a bit off and the press strength required varies between some parts (some are very tight, some just like lego and some a little loose but not to the point of falling apart without force). Some of the hinge pieces are loose too but seeing as they are used in top/bottom pairs in this build it doesn't matter.
    On the official TLG release of this I've noticed over time some of the parts separating slightly simply due to gravity and I've always just given them a good push back together so that they sit nice and tightly. I'd be interested to see if the grip is slightly looser in some cases if this causes problems of parts falling off if displayed for an extended period.
  • BobflipBobflip Member Posts: 622
    Recce said:
    CCC said:
    Recce said:
    CCC said:
    Because 5 years later someone pays huge money for the old lego set?:)
    Probably not if Lego fans become accepting of fakes.
    This had me thinking, if say someone is willing to pay $10K for a Lego Cafe Corner in 10 years time, there might actually be someone else willing to pay $1K or $2K for a Lepin version.
    Not if Lepin, or another company, are still making "Corner Cafe" or similar.
    I do believe the life span of Lepin modulars will be much much shorter than that of a Lego modular. Remember, Lepin is not as big as TLG or anywhere close at all, their tactic is probably to sell a particular modular for a short period of time and then move on. Thus it is possible 1 or 2 years from now they may just disappear from the market. 
    Though if Lepin are still about, and the originals are still getting the high prices, it seems that they won't have any trouble at all churning out another fresh batch.
    Lunchietey said:
    Also parts are grouped and bagged in their entirety(although they are done to make part locating as easy as you probably could without 400 bags) so it can be time consuming finding parts for each step. I'm not sure it's a big deal, does make it a slower build but almost more fun to me.
    I think I'd enjoy a single bag a smidge more as well. It's like, when you get a jigsaw puzzle, they don't bag the parts up into sections of the finished picture!
  • LunchieteyLunchietey Australia Member Posts: 24
    edited September 2016
    This is what I mean by the parts are all bagged by type, not step. Similar part like wedges that are in left/right are in different bags though so it's easy to grab 1 of each etc without having to sort through. Quite well thought out really.

    You can see my coffee mug top right for scale and a genuine Lego 75149 box far left.
  • BobflipBobflip Member Posts: 622
    Ah, gotcha. I end up doing that to an extent anyway!
  • datsunrobbiedatsunrobbie West Haven , CTMember Posts: 1,698
    Have any owners of both LEGO and Lepin versions of the same sets posted a "parallel build" review? There has been talk of too tight, too loose, and just right parts in both, and I'm curious to see if the same parts of each build have the same issues. If LEPIN is using stolen molds it would make sense that any issues in building the LEGO original would also be found in the Lepin clone.
  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278

    There is at least a comparison for the Porsche GT3 RS of Lego versus Lepin. Not a "parallel build" though afaik.

    But from my personal building experience, I am sure the Lepin molds are not stolen Lego molds. Not only is the Lego branding missing, but the Lepin parts have other important differences, like different injection points, which would be a showstopper in that respect. Also some parts vary ever so slightly, like the six white fender pieces (4646576) used as window arches on the Town Hall clone. The geometry of the curve is a little different, with a bit of a "straight" bit where the Lego Version seems to be more of a real half-circle. Things like that.

  • AustinPowersAustinPowers GermanyMember Posts: 278
    @Lunchietey: is that the Lepin SSD instruction manual? Do they make a ringbound version like the Lego original now? I thought they only had standard bound manuals.
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,922
    edited September 2016
    Recce said:
    I believe it has been discussed before, i.e. like all other companies TLG does not have unlimited resource, they have new annual inhouse products, licensed theme products etc that need to get released quarterly.


    This I just don't get at all. When I was young, there was one Lego catalog a year. And sets were available for many years.

    Now there are two Lego catalogs a year, plus an endless array of exclusives, polybags, etc. that aren't even in the catalogs. Ever more models at an ever increasing pace. There are too many mediocre sets already, so why flood the market with so many new sets all the time? Why not bring out less but better models like it used to be?

    There was a time when LEGO models were better than they have been in the past decade? That's news to me. I understand that nostalgia can be powerful, but themes like Ninjago, Friends, Elves, and Nexo Knights keep bringing out amazing set after amazing set, with some like #41101, #41180, #70323, and #70595 offering exceptional display value and playability compared to anything I grew up with, or any classic sets I've seen from before my childhood.

    Even in themes like City, Creator, and Star Wars that are often criticized for being repetitive, I don't think the design quality in recent years has been any less exceptional than in decades gone by. The only recent themes I can think of that are widely perceived as having weaker designs than their classic counterparts are the latest iterations of Castle and Pirates, which had just five sets each, considerably less than they often had in the 80s and 90s. So I'm not really buying the claim that fewer sets means better sets.

    Now, I'm sure any AFOL could rattle off a list of sets that they think are "unnecessary" and that LEGO could do without. Like new City police stations, or new versions of classic Star Wars ships, or new Ninjago vehicles, or entire themes like Friends and Disney Princess. But as it turns out, these tend to be some of the best-selling sets year after year. Even for my part, I was not remotely excited that LEGO got the Jurassic World license, yet those sets still seemingly sold like hotcakes.

    Now, if LEGO did in fact decide to cut sets and themes they thought were "unnecessary", chances are that some of the first to go would be AFOL/TFOL-oriented themes like Creator Expert, Star Wars UCS, Architecture, and Ideas, since these sets tend to be produced and sold in much smaller numbers and to a much smaller and less reliable audience than City police stations, Friends dollhouses, Ninjago vehicles, Millennium Falcons, and X-Wing fighters.

    I understand that the situation may be different in Germany, where LEGO has been a staple toy for decades. But LEGO has a much broader audience in the United States today than it did during my childhood in the 90s, and I think both the sheer variety of new sets they offer these days and the improved design quality of those sets are connected with that.

    stluxkhmellymel
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    Recce said:
    CCC said:
    It's a strange thing to do. If they are inferior, why build an inferior model but pay more than the original (as you buy both) for a worse build experience. If they are an acceptable alternative, then surely there is not so much long term value in the original as others will think that too.
    They re not inferior, just think of it as paying a small fee to get the chance to own, build and play with it.
    Note I didn't say they were inferior. I gave two possible views - they are either inferior or acceptable alternatives. They could be one to one person and the other to another. Just like a device without an apple badge might be inferior to someone (even if it is better to many others). Inferior / acceptable is very subjective.
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,922


    And standard sets are getting more expensive every year, at a rate far higher than general inflation. What does that tell us? That Lego is moving ever further away from its former core customer base and into the premium/luxury realm. At the same time they are throwing more and more product at the customers. I think we have seen a similar thing happen in the past, which then resulted in the near collapse of TLG. Let's hope they are not moving too far in that direction again. Because this time, if they were, companies like Lepin at al would be there to take over the market for sure.
    Yeah, I'm not seeing it. The peak non-D2C sets in themes like Ninjago, Chima, and Nexo Knights have been stable at $120/€120 since 2011. Last year's Millennium Falcon, the most expensive non-UCS Star Wars set currently available, had the same exact cost in Euros as its 2011 counterpart, and the price in USD was the same adjusted for inflation. Friends pushed the envelope with the $130/€130 Heartlake Grand Hotel last year, which became one of their top-selling sets that year, before returning to a comfortable peak price of $100/€100 this year. Duplo prices have fluctuated, but actually peaked in 2008, with this year's biggest set priced equally to the biggest sets of 1996, 2000, 2005 and 2006. The only one of the LEGO Group's top themes that seems to have increased in peak price in the past five or six years is City, but even then, prices on staple sets like police stations, fire stations, and airports has been fairly stable over that time.

    Also, the LEGO Group's previous near-collapse was never because of prices. If anything, TLG had been undercharging for certain products due to a complete failure to understand what their products were costing them to produce in the late 90s and early naughts. Read Brick by Brick if you want to understand what actually brought about that crisis, and how their current strategies evolved out of the strategies they used to get out of it.
    Lyichir
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,776
    I think pretty much every kid my children know have some Lego, recent sets at that. Isn't that the core customer base?
    datsunrobbieSumoLego
  • Pitfall69Pitfall69 0 miles to Legoboy's houseMember Posts: 11,444
    Recce said:
    It's interesting to compare Apple with TLG. Apple is no longer a monopoly whereas TLG still is in terms of the toy bricks market. 

    The first few years of the iphone we saw lots of copycats appearing with Apple launching lawsuits left and right. Thank god that didn't stop the advancement of technological innovations and now we have products from other companies that have better features and at cheaper prices, can't imagine what the world would be like if Apple was able to stop all copycats and remain a monopoly till today, l'd imagine the Apple tax would be astronomical, not that it isn't now (with competitors no less). 

    The Lego tax situation is exactly same as the Apple tax. Even the fan boy behaviours are the same, countless times I've seen and heard people saying "I would never buy a product just because it is not Apple", and blindly disregard logical thinkings of features and price point benefits. A fan boy is a fan boy after all, regardless of which company they worship. 

    No one doubted the efforts of innovators, engineers and designers that throughout the years come out with ideas and brilliantly designed products as they have every right to be monetarily compensated, but when the company is making billions of dollars out of those products you had to wonder how much they really overcharged on the products and when will the monopoly ends. It's a good thing there is a time limit for copyright holders, else they would be earning billions or even trillions till eternity.

    And you know what? The sad truth out of all these is that most if not all of the money are pocketed by the company's top executives with close to nothing left for the actual designers, except the basic salary. 
    What "brilliantly designed products" or "innovative technology" has LEPIN put forth? 
    SprinkleOtterAanchirTheBigLegoski
  • TheBigLegoskiTheBigLegoski Amsterdam, NederlandMember Posts: 1,435
    Uugh!
    People comparing Lego to Apple, how ludicrous.

    The big huge vast enormous gigantuous difference:
    • Lego is all about: do whatever you like with the bricks, be creative or not (keep the sets MISB for all TLG cares). Use your new bricks and 40 year old bricks, and have fun!
    • Apple is all about: worship how we have decided you can only use our products as we see fit. Buy it now! Not because the last version you bought was at the end of its 'life cycle', has become obsolete, but because we have released a new version we want you to buy. Show off to all your hipster/snobby friends your new Apple product that in many cases doesn't do anything your last apple product didn't already do too.
    MaffyDSprinkleOtterPitfall69LunchieteyShibSumoLegoBrickfan50
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