Looking for specific 2x4 Brick! (Pat Pending Obscured...)

samtheq · May 2016

Hi there--

New to this forum. I have been working on a Lego "history project" that I now regret starting...I was planning to make a shadowbox/display thingy showing the "evolution of the 2x4 brick." I was planning to hit the more obvious changes, and now I keep finding more variations every time I look.

It's nearly impossible to find specific variations on Bricklink. In fact, it's a nightmare. Lots of nice sellers, but I can't quite describe it to them.

I'm looking for what I think is #25 in the list below:

http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/parts.php?group=2&withimages=yes&language=en#top

In other words, a 2x4 brick, (it would be ABS), with the "Pat Pending" obscured (blobbed over, from the mold being altered), that has normal TUBES ONLY. In other words, no sidebars, crossbars, or ridges, no slit tubes. So, a brick made LATE enough to have the "Pat Pending" obscured, but EARLY enough to not have any of the features I mentioned. (It's fairly easy to find such a brick with the horizontal crossbar, that goes along the center of the brick through the center of the tubes.)

I'd like red if possible, but at this point, I'd take whatever.

Can anybody point me in the right direction, as to where and how I could order this thing?

My sanity thanks you, very much! And also, my wife.

samQ
[email protected]

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

I probably have that brick in red. I'll have a look when I get home.

That site is a good start, but there are many more styles that aren't included. If you send me a list of what you have found so far, I can help fill in the blanks. I have thousands of 2x4 bricks :)

CupIsHalfEmpty · May 2016

Wow there's more than 42 variations?! I had a fleeting thought the other week about collecting the different versions of a 2x4 and framing as well. I think I'll just back away slowly at this point.

However, I will check into my vintage brick bin to see if I have what you are looking for.

samtheq · May 2016

I'd much appreciate it--tonight I'll revise my list and send it to both of you or add it here tomorrow. Thanks!

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

Definitely more than 42 variations if you consider different plastics, different logos, and all the major changes that have been made to the basic brick design over the years. And that's not including the very subtle differences like the placement of the mold number or the shape of the tubes underneath. If you count all possible mold variations, there are easily hundreds.

Then if you throw test bricks into the mix, that number goes up even more :)

samtheq · May 2016

I see what you mean. I am not going down the road of mold numbers, or test bricks for that matter. My own personal project is major (design) changes. Otherwise, I think I'd go mad!

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

No test bricks? You're missing out!

Once you post your list I can fill any major gaps, then we can talk about how far down the rabbit hole you want to go :)

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

OK, it seems I don't have that brick after all. I checked a few hundred reds, and all the pat pend obscured bricks either have a center ridge or split tubes. Sorry!

I'm sure I can help in other areas though - just let me know.

samtheq · May 2016

Aww! Thanks for checking, mpfirnhaber. I do appreciate it. I went though hundreds of bricks myself last night!! I got one answer on Lego Answers Beta that this brick (#8 below) exists, but no photos. Maybe it doesn't exist?

Here's my list so far (I know including years is pretty sketchy, as I've learned while doing this, there's a lot of overlap):1)bslot04 - CA 2x4 brick, hollow block with one slot, (block logo inside): 1949-19502)bslot04a - CA 2x4 brick, hollow block with two slots, block letter logo: 1951-53 [Two variants: slots at opposite ends, slots at 90-degree angle]

3)bslot04a - CA 2x4 brick, hollow block with two slots, dogbone logo: c.1954-55

4)bhol04 - CA 2x4 brick, hollow block, no slots, old logo on studs: 1956-1957 5)CA 2x4 brick, Side Pip, Pat Pending, Old font, first Tubes (smaller diameter): 1958-1962
6a) ABS 2x4 brick, End Pip, Pat Pending, Samsonite font: 1961-1970 [ABS began 1963] 6b) ABS 2x4 brick, End Pip, Pat Pending, Modern font, Tubes only: [Samsonite, 1966]7a) ABS 2x4 brick, End Pip, Pat Pending, Old font (O touching), Horizontal Crossbars: PRE-1974 [Samsonite, 1966]7b) ABS 2x4 brick, End Pip, Pat Pending Obscured, Old Font, Horizontal Crossbars: POST-1974 8) 3001old - ABS 2x4 brick, (? Pip), Pat Pending Obscured, (Modern logo?): 1963-1974 [Note: what I'm missing!!]
9a) ABS 2x4 brick, (? Pip), Pat Pending, Modern font, Slit Tubes with Sidebars: 9b) ABS 2x4 brick, Stud Pip, Pat Pending Obscured, Modern font, Slit Tubes with Sidebars: 1974-1979 9c) ABS 2x4 brick, Stud Pip, NO Pat Pending, Modern font, Slit Tubes with Sidebars: 1974-1979
10a) ABS 2x4 clear brick, (? Pip), Pat Pending, Modern font, Tubes only, Frosted Interior, smaller brick(?) 10b) ABS 2x4 clear brick, Side Pip, NO Pat Pending, Modern font, Tubes only, Frosted Interior: 1976-1977
11) ABS 2x4 brick, Stud Pip, NO Pat Pending, Modern font, NO Part ID#: c.1980-1984
12) ABS 2x4 brick, Stud Pip, NO Pat Pending, Modern font, NO Part ID#, Cross Supports with Sidebars: c.1985-1990
13) ABS 2x4 brick, Stud Pip, NO Pat Pending, Modern font, "3001" Part ID#, Cross Supports with Sidebars: 1990-CURRENT

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

Are you collecting different plastics? The no-logo bslot04 bricks come in 3 major plastics depending on where they were manufactured.
There are 4 major variations on the old logo, and all are available in both CA and ABS.
There are 4 types of blockletter logo on slotted bricks.
Later slotted bricks come in one and two slot varieties, as well as various configurations of corner slots.
You're missing all Norwegian slotted and hollow bricks, there are several varieties.
Not sure if you want to go this far, but there are some rare transitional bricks, like CA bricks with cross-supports, and thin-walled bricks with no cross-support and no split tubes. These tend to be expensive if you can even find them (upwards of $50 per brick)
There are two styles of bricks with sideways logos. Both are available in both ABS and CA.
You also need red 2x4 Modulex, Duplo, Quatro, Soft, Minitalia, and OLO :)

samtheq · May 2016

Interesting! I knew about a few of the things you list, but certainly not all. I'll make notations on my list if I want to "expand" (which I seem to keep doing!). I did know about the sideways logo brick, which was supposedly only done for a year, and I figured it was near impossible to find, and probably expensive.
Certainly impossible on Bricklink, which I really like, but is bad for things like we are discussing!

I wish I could see inside of the photo for #25 that I linked to above.
It doesn't quite look like it has a "center ridge" through the middle of the tubes, but I can't see for sure. I'm assuming that it doesn't, and that the ridge was tried and then abandoned due to later improvements.

mpfirnhaber · May 2016

I have extras of a few types of sideways logo bricks in red, they won't be expensive if you want some. They were made in Canada by Samsonite, and also in the Wrexham, Wales factory for a bit.

In fact, I should have extras of almost everything I listed. I'm sure we can work something out :)

Here's my Flickr page if you're interested
https://www.flickr.com/photos/11462722@N03/

And here's another page with a LOT of good info on 2x4 bricks
https://www.flickr.com/photos/111441268@N03/albums/72157648936541745

madforLEGO · May 2016

@Istokg may make your life worse, but he can also verify the different bricks available I think

samtheq · May 2016

Wow, thanks mpfirnhaber, for the Flickr links! Great pages. I could look at this stuff all day! I am still hunting for a good photo of my "quest" brick--you have a good photo called "Evolution" that shows the development of white 2x4s; is it one of those on the right?

madforLEGO, you make a good point--I've been reading some of his posts!

WoutR · May 2016

The #25 in that list is the pat.pend.obscured version of #23.
It DOES have the flowrib (horizontal crossbar). It should be easy to find.

http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/part.php?language=en&group=4&sq=23

I am still looking for #31
Brick 2 x 4 without Cross Supports, with Hole in Top and Samsonite (Open 'O') logo.
http://www.leggodt.nl/items/lego/part.php?language=en&group=4&sq=31
If anyone in the USA/Canada knows where to find one, please let me know!

WoutR · May 2016

samtheq said:

Wow, thanks mpfirnhaber, for the Flickr links! Great pages. I could look at this stuff all day!

The Flickr page that mpfirnhaber linked is mine. I am still frequently adding information to it.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/111441268@N03/sets/72157648936541745
(if you browse by album, the bricks are shown in an approximately chronologic order, grouping similar bricks together)

If you have any questions, feel free to ask :-)
(Note that I might be more responsive on Flickr than here)

I think you were trying to find this brick:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/11462722@N03/21881393444
with the pat.pend obscured. Those do not exist. These molds ended their functional life before the pat.pend markings were obscured.

WoutR · May 2016

Here is a quick image showing the main evolution of the 2x4 brick. (The mold markings are only drawn in where required to separate mold versions.

There are many interesting exceptions, but this image covers the vast majority of bricks out there.

samtheq · May 2016

<<I think you were trying to find this brick:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/11462722@N03/21881393444>>

Exactly right, WoutR. Thank you for the information. You have made my day. Your flickr page is fantastic, and the chart you just sent is like manna from heaven!

WoutR · May 2016

I started my Flickr page because I faced the same problem as you. The available information was fragmented and incomplete, I needed a place to bring it all together and make it available for discussion. By sharing our information we can learn the most.

chuckp · May 2016

samtheq Do you have an idea of the year(s) the brick was sold? I'd be happy to my collection if it was produced during the years I've collected LEGO.

Looking for specific 2x4 Brick! (Pat Pending Obscured...)

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