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Predictions on Discontinuing Sets and their Secondary Market Value

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  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    msanders said:
    Everyone keeps calling Megablocks a knockoff brand. Is this really true? They seminars to buy their own licenses. Do they directly make clone Lego sets or minifigures? I don't know enough about the brand to know. Surely if the are paying for an IP (minions, turtles and thomas) then they can't be called knockoff? I vaguely remember seeing some 'Friends' like sets made by Megablocks? That's not great. 
     MB is a knock-off, to me, because it tries to use the secret ingredient that makes another thing special in a (somewhat questionably) legal way. one example that comes to mind is Psych and The Mentalist.

    A clone brand is something that tries to copy the original in every way except quality, with no regard for legality. Like pair of guys reading off a Psych script and trying to act on a cheap set.
  • MattsWhatMattsWhat Studley, UKMember Posts: 1,643
    edited April 2016
    ^I would have said the opposite.
    It's interesting as MB aren't actually doing anything wrong.  The patent on the Lego brick expired ages ago, so they are well within their rights to manufacture an interlocking building material with their own sets designs and licences (perfectly legally).  I call this a clone brand as they have cloned the brand - i.e. they make stuff in the same way that Lego do, not the same stuff as Lego.
    I would call it a knock-off when they try to make the same product as Lego, like a knock-off minifig or set.  This is illegal as it is copying IP, something that MB are not doing - they are making original IP such as CoD sets.

    Peter Kjaer (head of Lego's IP dept.) said this which I find interesting...
    "Analyses show that 40-60 percent of shoppers believe they are buying a LEGO product when in fact they are purchasing a different product. Shoppers can see there is a different name on the box, but they believe it is a product line or company owned by us."
    Maybe knock-offs do more damage than we think.

    madforLEGOcatwrangleraldreddAmanda1983
  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    ^ On the LEGO brick, not necessarily all of the sub-parts LEGO makes. I and it still seems wrong, so I question its legality...
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,922
    ^ On the LEGO brick, not necessarily all of the sub-parts LEGO makes. I and it still seems wrong, so I question its legality...
    Generally, most of the Mega Bloks sets I've seen and the few I've owned do not seem to replicate a lot of LEGO parts beyond the most basic bricks and plates. That's more than can be said for a lot of other brands, even purportedly high-quality ones like Oxford/Kre-O. Mega Bloks and K'nex strike me as some of the most reputable "clone brands" for this reason.

    That doesn't mean I like them. I feel like the design quality of many K'nex building sets has generally taken a nosedive since they started producing "bricks" (I was a fan of K'nex before that, and it's sad to see them fall so far), and while Mega Bloks is doing an alright job with design, their color quality and clutch power are still a lot less consistent than I've come to expect from LEGO products.

    It's also extremely sad how few original properties Mega Bloks has these days — other than last year's "Kapow! Blok Bots Fighting League" and the perennial "First Builders", pretty much every product they have is based on either a licensed property or a pre-existing Mattel property. Mega Bloks has never really matched LEGO in terms of quality, but once upon a time I feel like they were a lot more innovative.
    datsunrobbieAmanda1983
  • mathewmathew Member Posts: 2,098
    Aanchir said:
    ^ On the LEGO brick, not necessarily all of the sub-parts LEGO makes. I and it still seems wrong, so I question its legality...
    It's also extremely sad how few original properties Mega Bloks has these days — other than last year's "Kapow! Blok Bots Fighting League" and the perennial "First Builders", pretty much every product they have is based on either a licensed property or a pre-existing Mattel property. Mega Bloks has never really matched LEGO in terms of quality, but once upon a time I feel like they were a lot more innovative.

    Mega Bloks relies heavily on liscensing the same way Lego does.  They just don't have the same R&D budget that Lego has so pretty much all of it goes towards liscensed sets.  It's a business decision.  Having competition also keeps Lego in check with their pricing.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,772
    I think licensed sets are even more important to MB than Lego. Their original sets don't seem to compete so well with Lego, so they need the licensed sets to make sales, rather than innovate their own in-house ranges. 
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,922
    CCC said:
    I think licensed sets are even more important to MB than Lego. Their original sets don't seem to compete so well with Lego, so they need the licensed sets to make sales, rather than innovate their own in-house ranges. 
    That's part of what seems so sad to me. During the late 90s and early naughts when LEGO was struggling, Mega Bloks had an impressive range of innovative in-house themes. Of course, I don't know for sure how well any of those did, but it's sad to see that now that LEGO is back at the top of their game, one of their biggest building toy competitors has basically given up entirely on creating competitive brands that are entirely their own.

    Of course, a lot of Mega Bloks themes these days are technically non-licensed, but only because they're Mattel brands (Barbie, Monster High, etc) and Mega Bloks is a subsidiary of Mattel. But they're still not original brands being generated within the Mega Bloks division.

    By contrast, sure, LEGO has a lot of licensed themes, but just look at their 2015 Annual Report: only one of their top five themes was strictly licensed (Star Wars), three were strictly non-licensed (City, Friends, Ninjago), and one was a little of both (Duplo). Licensing is important to the LEGO Group but it seems like they're experiencing much more success with in-house brands than Mega Bloks is these days.
    Amanda1983
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,772
    In a way, ninjago is licensed as the range is supported by TV (or vice versa) just like MB and Mattel crossovers.
    Amanda1983
  • AanchirAanchir United StatesMember Posts: 2,922
    edited April 2016
    CCC said:
    In a way, ninjago is licensed as the range is supported by TV (or vice versa) just like MB and Mattel crossovers.
    Ninjago was still developed in-house as a LEGO brand, though. The TV show was created to support the building sets. The characters, locations, vehicles, etc. are ultimately based on the work of LEGO designers.

    That can't be said for, say, Monster High or He-Man, both of which existed as toy lines and media properties long before Mega Bloks got their hands on them. Even if they aren't paying royalties (because their parent company owns the brands), Mega Bloks is still adapting existing properties into building toys, not creating new properties based on their building toys.

    To put it another way: would you consider Fabuland a licensed theme because it was supported by videocassettes and picture books? Or Rock Raiders a licensed theme because it was supported by a PC game? If not, where do you draw the line?
    RogerKirkAmanda1983
  • tamamahmtamamahm Member Posts: 1,977
    Another one MB is doing is an American Girl line. It is another case of one under the company umbrella.
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
     MB is a knock-off, to me, because it tries to use the secret ingredient that makes another thing special in a (somewhat questionably) legal way. one example that comes to mind is Psych and The Mentalist.

    A clone brand is something that tries to copy the original in every way except quality, with no regard for legality. Like pair of guys reading off a Psych script and trying to act on a cheap set.
    I think the common usage of 'knock-off' is interchangeable with 'clone brand'.  Except that a 'knock-off' would usually be considered worse, in that it is a deliberately fraudulent copy of what one actually wants to purchase.

    I don't think anyone would consider a $385.00 Marc Jacobs bag that resembles a $2350.00 Givenchy to be a 'knock-off'.

    Psych and the Mentalist are similar concepts, but Psych didn't actually try to get advertisers to buy air-time claiming to be the Mentalist.

    I think you are searching for another term for knock-off: Crappy Competitor
    VorpalRyuAmanda1983
  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    edited April 2016
    Psych and the Mentalist are similar concepts, but Psych didn't actually try to get advertisers to buy air-time claiming to be the Mentalist.
    Other way around- Psych came first. Something that was a common fourth-wall breaking joke in the series.
    SumoLegoAmanda1983
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
    Right - but you get my point.  
    Amanda1983
  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    edited April 2016
    ^ Absolutely. I was just making a comparison.
    Amanda1983
  • Jackad7Jackad7 Wisconsin Member Posts: 555
    I'm kind of with msaders. They don't advertise as Lego and don't copy Lego themes (IE picking up categories Lego doesn't do such as Halo and Call of Duty and not mimicking Lego figures). They also are a cheap alternative for kid's who arent as bothere's by the non-Lego brand. I would say I was taught to be pretty frugal so often times I would buy the mythical castle version of mega bloks for playing with, usually only gething lego's for birthdayso r christmas. I never mixed my Legos and mega bloks but I did enjoy the inexpensive fun sets. I remember I got a really big boat for $5 free shipping on ebay. Still have it to this day. It's like buying Pokémon cards and Magic the gathering cards, same concept, different product, as opposed to buying real magic the gathering cards and fake magic the gathering cards. 
    (Magic the gathering and Pokémon are trading card games that I figured would be the most well now to make the analogy
    Amanda1983
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
    I guess I can get hyper-focused on the minutiae.  I don't care for MB and I think their products stink, but they have their own standards, adhere to regulations and attempt to compete with Lego in a legitimate way.

    Labeling them as knock-offs is lumping them in with more nefarious manufacturers that do not respect any legal or moral standards.

    As I adjust my Polex watch, my Berberry tie and Gregorio Aramini suit.  I also need to get home in time to watch the Mantelist on Nettflicks.

    With the lively (muddled) discussion regarding labeling custom/modified Lego figures, I think it is important to have a specific way to identify certain products.
    BumblepantscatwranglerpharmjodricecakesnowhitiedougtsAmanda1983
  • msandersmsanders Member Posts: 1,006
    ^ I think you've done a great job of defining the terms. 
  • RogerKirkRogerKirk BrightonMember Posts: 364
    Shib said:
    SumoLego said:


    With the lively (muddled) discussion regarding labeling custom/modified Lego figures, I think it is important to have a specific way to identify certain products.
    This is the big issue for me, I deliberately avoid the term clone as I think there is quite a bit of ambiguity around the term. Those that operate legally, such as MB kreo etc i generally call other brands, those that operate illegally by manufacturing imitation LEGO parts and don't aquire correct licencin i refer to as counterfiet, those that print/chrome genuine parts or manufacture suplimentary parts that LEGO don't make (such as brick forge) etc i call customs.
    a big part of the distinction is HOW they are operating rather than what they are making. While im not a fan of other brands i will try them from time ti time as point of reference for quality against LEGO, those operating illegally I won't go near, I know too many artists strugling for any recognition to support people who don't pay IP owners their due.
    You've summed it up perfectly there.

    That said, I don't like Mega Bloks and it pains me to see three Mega Blok bricks in my son's Duplo collection. However, they are over 20 years old (belonged to my sister), like half the Duplo, so that's why I keep them.
    Amanda1983
  • Farmer_JohnFarmer_John USA - 4,035 Miles from 62 West Wallaby St., Wigan, Lancashire, UKMember Posts: 2,404
    Sometimes I find the odd Mega Blok in my Lego parts. I have no idea how they get there, but it's kind of like they want to hang out with the cool kids or something.

    I think a family member is messing with me...
    FollowsCloselyprevereSprinkleOttercatwranglerbandit778RonyarJackad7Amanda1983
  • wagnerml2wagnerml2 Belleville, IllinoisMember Posts: 1,376
    My wife's nurse loves me because every job lot I buy I sort out the MB and give them to her son.  He is a huge Halo fan and probably has the best Halo collection in the county.
    Jackad7catwranglerpreverechuckpsnowhitieAmanda1983
  • Pitfall69Pitfall69 0 miles to Legoboy's houseMember Posts: 11,444
    ^Your wife's nurse? Is she ok? 
    Jackad7Amanda1983
  • makmak Member Posts: 300
    ^ Who, the wife or the nurse? 
    Amanda1983
  • wagnerml2wagnerml2 Belleville, IllinoisMember Posts: 1,376
    Wife is a pediatrician.....Her nurse. :)
    Pitfall69Jackad7Amanda1983
  • MattsWhatMattsWhat Studley, UKMember Posts: 1,643
    edited April 2016
    How long has it been since someone mentioned a product EOL or it's value?
    Does anyone else feel like the Hoth UCS spells the end of the Ewoks?  Or maybe the VW Bug finally brings the VW camper to a close?
    Milne44Amanda1983
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Chicagoland USMember Posts: 10,154
    MattsWhat said:
    How long has it been since someone mentioned a product EOL or it's value?
    Does anyone else feel like the Hoth UCS spells the end of the Ewoks?  Or maybe the VW Bug finally brings the VW camper to a close?
    I'm guessing yes to both. The VW camper van has now crossed into DS territory with regards to never dying, and I do not see LEGO wanting to have both an Ewok and Hoth set out at the same time as one would think they somewhat 'compete' against each other.
    Amanda1983
  • wagnerml2wagnerml2 Belleville, IllinoisMember Posts: 1,376
    I guess my question about VW Camper Van is whether it was ever really that good of a seller.  DS hung around because it was expensive, every kid wanted one and it sold at a steady pace I would think.  I can't see the Camper Van ticking all those boxes.  I have 3 that I picked up years ago.  Kinda wish I'd have bought something else.
  • BumblepantsBumblepants DFWMember Posts: 6,982
    ^Good question. Surely the answer has to be 'yes, it sold well' or they would have ended it ages ago. I got one when they were giving the mini version free with it. Never got around to building it though and will probably just sell it at some point to get something I like better.
    madforLEGOjuggles7Amanda1983
  • prevereprevere North of Bellville, East of Heartlake, South of Bricksburg, West of Ninjago City Member Posts: 2,923
    The new VW Bug has got to mean a end to the Camper.
  • madforLEGOmadforLEGO Chicagoland USMember Posts: 10,154
    ^Good question. Surely the answer has to be 'yes, it sold well' or they would have ended it ages ago. I got one when they were giving the mini version free with it. Never got around to building it though and will probably just sell it at some point to get something I like better.
    My 10 year old nephew actually wanted one because he likes the way it looks (even when dad explained that it is not really a play toy but more as a display piece). Maybe it is just me, but I typically do not hear younger kids wanting something that is more of a display piece. (Though I think my brother would have rather knew this in advance when they could be had on sale in the US)
    Bumblepants
  • catwranglercatwrangler Northern IrelandMember Posts: 1,890
    This is making me twitchy! I'd been thinking for a while about getting a camper, as it's a lovely model and my partner and I always enjoy spotting the real vehicles when we're out and about, so it seemed like it would be a nice thing to build together. Looks like it might need to be pushed up the to-buy list...
  • CircleKCircleK U.S. - Columbus, OhioMember Posts: 1,055
    What is the consensus on #76022 X-Men Vs. The Sentinel? Decent figs, iconic vehicle, nice change from Spiderman and Avengers but it seemed to hang around awhile and was heavily discounted in some areas. 
    Amanda1983
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    I have more #76022 than I care to admit. I'm optimistic though as I think it may be the last x-men set for a while. I could see it hitting $70-$100 over time, especially if new movies continue to drive interest.
    CircleKBumblepants
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
    prevere said:
    The new VW Bug has got to mean a end to the Camper.
    I think I said the same thing about the Ferrari.  Yet, it still persists...
    Amanda1983
  • AllBrickAllBrick UKMember Posts: 1,477
    Quick question. Just acquired a #76039 . Should I open it or, stash it away for umpteen years?
  • LegoboyLegoboy 100km furtherMember Posts: 8,831
    AllBrick said:
    Quick question. Just acquired a #76039 . Should I open it or, stash it away for umpteen years?
    It's twenty quid!  Open it!
    catwranglerLego_StarAmanda1983
  • AllBrickAllBrick UKMember Posts: 1,477
    edited April 2016
    Legoboy said:
    AllBrick said:
    Quick question. Just acquired a #76039 . Should I open it or, stash it away for umpteen years?
    It's twenty quid!  Open it!
    £15.99 actually. Thought maybe it was worth saving investment wise for my boy. I'm new to this. I do so want those purple ants though.
    Amanda1983
  • MattsWhatMattsWhat Studley, UKMember Posts: 1,643
    It'll go up, but the minifigures will do well if looked after too. But no point keeping something you want sealed. Otherwise, why bother opening anything? 
    madforLEGOJackad7Amanda1983
  • catwranglercatwrangler Northern IrelandMember Posts: 1,890
    I would say, life is short, open it. and enjoy the purple ants! Also because the "giant Lego bricks" look really cool. And with a lower-priced item like that (compared to many other superhero sets, I mean) it might be best to pick up another one to save for investment purposes when you have some spare cash.
    AllBrickAmanda1983
  • pharmjodpharmjod 1,170 miles to Wall Drug, USAMember Posts: 2,916
    edited April 2016
    Personally, if I had access to them at msrp, I'd buy all of that set I could. It's gonna keep going up. I think the civil war movie will give it a bump.
    goshe7Amanda1983
  • ScatterbugScatterbug WalesMember Posts: 109
    76039 is only doing well in America, not Europe.
  • Farmer_JohnFarmer_John USA - 4,035 Miles from 62 West Wallaby St., Wigan, Lancashire, UKMember Posts: 2,404
    My daughter just sent me this to me...

    I think it would go great with the new Death Star.


    bp10030madforLEGOLegoboycatwranglerwagnerml2snowhitieYodaliciousAmanda1983LEGOFan2
  • SprinkleOtterSprinkleOtter Member Posts: 2,751
    ^ I would buy one...
  • LegoboyLegoboy 100km furtherMember Posts: 8,831
    No prizes for guessing which SW planet TLG unwittingly created here.  SW tax included in the price too.  :)


    catwranglerLobotLego_StarGothamConstructionCoAmanda1983
  • SweepyDSweepyD USMember Posts: 78
    Hey now, that Alderaan is a fake! That number belongs to TFA MF! No, I'm not using sarcasm in any form...
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
    ^^ Is that the UCS Hoth set?
    VorpalRyucatwranglerYodaliciousAmanda1983
  • luckyrussluckyruss UKMember Posts: 872
    ^ No, it's got too many (base)plates in it!
    catwranglerAmanda1983
  • Farmer_JohnFarmer_John USA - 4,035 Miles from 62 West Wallaby St., Wigan, Lancashire, UKMember Posts: 2,404
    edited April 2016
    SweepyD said:
    Hey now, that Alderaan is a fake! That number belongs to TFA MF! No, I'm not using sarcasm in any form...
    Hmm...TLG must have made a mistake...

    P.S. I am using sarcasm.
    Amanda1983
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 14,226
    What are you using sarcasm for?

    I find it useful for opening jars of pickles.
    mgjvegasJackad7Amanda1983
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