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Suggestions for forum improvements

2

Comments

  • TheLoneTensorTheLoneTensor MericaMember Posts: 3,950
    Where the hell is the General Fabuland Discussion thread?!?!
    PurplorosLego_Starkiki180703SumoLegokhmellymelBumblepantslegomatt
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    edited September 2015
    ^ Agree 100% 

    This forum functions organically, (like any proper conversation amongst adults should). When there is something to say, someone says it, and does so in an appropriately titled (if not already existing) thread. 

    This means specific (short lifespan) issues get dealt with and disappear, whereas evergreen topics will by their nature generate continued chat and live on. It's natural. It's how people talk.

    Corralling conversations into arbitrarily prefabricated boundaries is an attempt to fix what isn't broken. It's rules for the sake of rules. It disregards the existing format and shows no appreciation for the way conversations actually occur.

    Also, artificially posting that list of topic/thread headers with no purpose beyond their own existence is the very definition of spamming, or is done so to enforce a format change without admin (or members) approval. It's nothing other than an attempt to usurp the existing forum from its users and dictate conversation - extremely disrespectful to the forum creators and rather condescending to the members.

    Lego_StarDedgeckoPaperballparkkiki180703snowhitiedougts
  • chuxtoyboxchuxtoybox Member Posts: 711
    WOW!
    My new suggestion would be a computer program that would keep one member from starting more than one thread a month.
    Dedgeckolegomattkiki180703dougts
  • dougtsdougts Oregon, USAMember Posts: 4,129
    edited September 2015
    I'm just going to quote myself from previous comments in these forums.  This encapsulates a large part of my thoughts on proper forum etiquette in general:

    but this is kind of the whole starting point of forum etiquette.  Watch awhile, lurk, learn the ropes, post comments on existing threads, get a feel for the community, then go in full force.

    I've been on here since the start, and I have over 3200 comments.  In all that time, I've started 17 threads.  That's 188 comments for every thread I've started.

    I'd say that in general on internet communities like this one that you shouldn't start a thread until you've been a part of the community at least a week or so, and that overall your comments should be at a minimum 30-40 times higher than your thread starter count.
    seriously, I appreciate your enthusiasm but you really should try to "fit in" more with a community you are trying to join rather then just blindly come charging in firing on all cylinders slamming out new topics left and right. Watch, read, observe, comment on existing threads.  Get a feel for how the community here works and work within it.  Good advice for life in general. 

    In general, everytime I see someone come into a forum community and start spamming off new threads left and right, or trying to change the community to fit their own ideas, I can't help but think it's another glaring example of the "I'm the center of the universe" syndrome.  The world revolves around them, and the rest of us are just lucky to be along for the ride.  It's like some sort of quest for internet fame or importance.  It's the "look at me!  look at me!  I'm important!!!!" effect kicking in full force.  It isn't enough to simply *join* the conversations, they feel some desire - even right - to be the center of it.  They simply are, by right, the most important person in the proverbial room.

  • samiam391samiam391 A Log Cabin in KY, United StatesMember Posts: 4,299
    ^ and ^^ and ^^^

    You all talk a lot more eloquently than I do. I just came out spitting fire everywhere. ;)
    SumoLegokiki180703
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802
     
    dougts said:
    I'm just going to quote myself from previous comments in these forums.
    I'd say that in general on internet communities like this one that you shouldn't start a thread until you've been a part of the community at least a week

    In general, everytime I see someone come into a forum community and start spamming off new threads left and right, or trying to change the community to fit their own ideas, I can't help but think it's another glaring example of the "I'm the center of the universe" syndrome.  The world revolves around them, and the rest of us are just lucky to be along for the ride.  It's like some sort of quest for internet fame or importance.  It's the "look at me!  look at me!  I'm important!!!!" effect kicking in full force.  It isn't enough to simply *join* the conversations, they feel some desire - even right - to be the center of it.  They simply are, by right, the most important person in the proverbial room.

    I think this is very unfair I have been a member since March 2013, I am not new. I did ask and suggest that it would be better for a mod to start these topics so was I looking to be 'center' of it?

    I think the part you are all looking for is 95345

    As well as starting 7 topics I did find a little bit of news that I would have thought would have been of interest to you.

    DC

    76052 Batman Classic TV Series Batcave (D2C we think so)

    Another Character Encyclopedia

    Marvel

    5003048 Hulk Age of Ultron Polybag

    Star Wars

    75143 A-Wing Starfighter (D2C?, Have no idea)

    75144 Snowspeeder (D2C?, Have no idea but was rumoured)

    Technic

    42053 Volvo EW 160E (The licenced sets we have got the last few years have been the flagship sets)

    I think some of the behaviour we have seen tonight has been very disappointing and has come close to bullying.

    I am not saying I did the right thing but I did try and add something, not just empty topics but news. I was going to collate more information for each topic from around the different sites but don't think I will now.

    There was 7 Topics added by me, even if they are all spam it is not the end of the world the forum will live on and nothing has been destroyed. Although it will take some time for me to view this site as the friendly welcoming place I always thought it was. 

  • HuwHuw Brickset Towers, Hampshire, UKAdministrator Posts: 6,562
    The mods have discussed...

    It might have been better to start with just one or two topics to test the waters, but we'll let them stand and allow them to run their course. They'll either disappear if there's a lack of interest or become a useful repository for all discussions about sets, rumours etc. for the theme, which might be preferable to a topic being started every time there's something new to talk about.


    SumoLegokiki180703
  • BooTheMightyHamsterBooTheMightyHamster Northern edge of London, just before the dragons...Member Posts: 1,311
    Hurrah!  Common sense has prevailed.
    Just let it be what it wants to be.  The good stuff thrives and the bad stuff dives.
    snowhitie
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 18,312
    I doubt Huw will care. Anyone can start threads with any title, so long as they are not offensive or completely off topic.

    But don't expect others to use them as you want them to be used. If someone else wants to discuss something specific about SW for example, then they can create their own thread and not have it lost in the general chit chat about SW.
    dougtskiki180703
  • HuwHuw Brickset Towers, Hampshire, UKAdministrator Posts: 6,562
    If that happens, that's fine.
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802

    Thanks @Huw I feel like I say that a lot and in my head I think about you as at-huw because I write it so much (not that I think about you a lot, I mean no more than normal, hang on whats a normal amount to think about Huw? should I post a topic asking?:)

    I should have maybe started with the ones I had interesting news about Star Wars, DC Marvel and oddly Technic. I see the new sets have been added to the database did this happen over night or were they there the whole time?

    You collect the flagship technic sets don't you? I was wondering if you think 42053 Volvo EW 160E is a flagship set as it is not the largest number, if its in scale to Volvo L350F then it should be smaller too. Would the Claas Xerion 5000 Tractor be a licensed set too.

    Also about the database, set 75098 has a price and dimensions when/how is this added and did it use to be on the 2015 page, if so how when did it more. I am just wondering because it looks like some of the sets added are D2C because they fit the rumors we have heard. I know you not really a rumors man but I like to play detective.

  • HuwHuw Brickset Towers, Hampshire, UKAdministrator Posts: 6,562
    We added the sets when Amazon.de published them a while ago but then hid them at LEGO's request. I updated the names from the list @paperballpark has been collating from the new information and also added the new sets, then un-hid them all this morning.

    LEGO probably won't like it but there has to come a point when it's acceptable to publish it: LEGO never says when that is, so we just have to do it and act on its reaction if needed.

  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802
    edited September 2015

    Thanks, I didn't happen look in 'Names for the next wave of Minecraft sets' as I thought it would just have names for the next wave of minecraft sets. Which I guess was my point the whole time, never mind.

    Right I am off to look though the database then to see what I can see, 2016 here we come.

  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 18,312
    Huw said:

    LEGO probably won't like it but there has to come a point when it's acceptable to publish it: LEGO never says when that is, so we just have to do it and act on its reaction if needed.

    I reckon you're safe when lego leak the names themselves.
  • PaperballparkPaperballpark UK / KLMember Posts: 3,544
    edited September 2015
    SMC said:

    Thanks, I didn't happen look in 'Names for the next wave of Minecraft sets' as I thought it would just have names for the next wave of minecraft sets.

    This is my only real gripe about the vanilla forums - you can't change thread titles. That thread was initially just about the Minecraft set names I found, but then I looked for other stuff too, and rather than add a new thread for each theme (I really dislike spam), I just added them in there. Maybe I should have thought harder about the thread name when I created it...
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802
    edited September 2015

    @Paperballpark Completely understand, I wasn't trying to have a go I just find it hard to find topics with this kind of information and I would have liked to join in but didn't see it. Its by far from the only topic where you find a conversation going on that is interesting but has little to do with the title. I feel this is where a little more structure can be helpful.

    Good find by the way but even on your topic @CM4S says "Weeks old (posted by yours truly) if you were on EB."

    But why are they not posted on brickset, is it in part because there is not a place for them to go.

    I still think these topics should have there own category, that way the one off topics wont get lost are nor will the general topics. It would also let people chose one or the other or both.
     

  • dougtsdougts Oregon, USAMember Posts: 4,129
    edited September 2015
    SMC said:
    But why are they not posted on brickset, is it in part because there is not a place for them to go.
    I honestly don't think that's it. We tend to discuss next wave sets here on the Brickset forum, but it doesn't seem like those discussions kick into gear until official pictures come out, etc. this forum hasn't shown to be as much of a hotbed for discussing leaks as other places. But those discussions do happen, and have been happening year after year here. It's just not usually as forced or as rabid as some other places.
    SMC said:
    I still think these topics should have there own category, that way the one off topics wont get lost are nor will the general topics. It would also let people chose one or the other or both.
     

    I don't think this proposal would "solve the problem" that you think this forum has. In fact, I don't even agree there is a problem that needs to be solved. We have discussion threads now for all these new set leaks. If there is an appetite to discuss them, they won't be hard for anyone to find.
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    @SMC I just want to apologise if my post here came across as unfriendly.

    I was only aware of this thread but hadn't paid too much attention to it, assuming, given the fact you asked about it as a suggestion rather than diving straight in, you were leaving any action up to the admins - i.e. that you were open to listening to the general consensus of the members, which my quick scan of the comments suggested was one of 'artificially forced topics along arbitrary catch-all theme boundaries before there's anything to actually say were not really required'.

    So when i next popped in intending to just quickly browse the forum, i was a little annoyed to find what appeared to be a whole raft of eurobricks style headers posted anyway, many of which it seemed were for no reason other than to 'claim the ground' so to speak without anything meaningful to say in them.... so it prompted me to post my objection above.

    Again, sorry if I came across as unfriendly - it just appeared that those views you originally sought had instead gone unheeded, and i was naturally a bit annoyed, especially as it looked like a case of forum spamming.

    --

    With regard the headings themselves. Setting up forums is like hosting a party. There's two ways to host a party - invite everyone and trust they sort themselves out, or go about the tables placing topics of discussion on idiot cards.
    The problem with the second is what is meant to help break the ice can, in the hands of the wrong host, become a miserable sterile environment, where the host forgets the original intent of the cards (just to get people going, and then leaving them to it), that host starts demanding that everyone stay in their pre-designated areas and along the topic boundaries, oblivious to the fact that everyone is having a good time.
    To many here, the brickset forum 'party' was already in full swing, and simply didn't need a host suddenly telling everyone where to stand.

    Anyway, water under the bridge. Again apologies. 

    dougtsMatthewnexandersamiam391SumoLegokiki180703DedgeckoBumblepantssnowhitie
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    edited September 2015
    samiam391 said:
    You all talk a lot more eloquently than I do. I just came out spitting fire everywhere. ;)
    Oh... In real life, I spit flaming ninja-feathers of bile and venomous bees on just about any absurd subject. The fun of it is in seeing the face of one's enemy pale with terror, stripped of life's illusions, and cowering beneath the withering hail of vitriol delivered with perfect comic timing, and a slice of lemon.... It's just not the same online, so i play nice here. ;oP
    samiam391mr.piggleskiki180703Dedgeckobandit778snowhitie
  • samiam391samiam391 A Log Cabin in KY, United StatesMember Posts: 4,299
    SMC said:

    @Paperballpark Completely understand, I wasn't trying to have a go I just find it hard to find topics with this kind of information and I would have liked to join in but didn't see it. Its by far from the only topic where you find a conversation going on that is interesting but has little to do with the title. I feel this is where a little more structure can be helpful.

    Good find by the way but even on your topic @CM4S says "Weeks old (posted by yours truly) if you were on EB."

    But why are they not posted on brickset, is it in part because there is not a place for them to go.

    I still think these topics should have there own category, that way the one off topics wont get lost are nor will the general topics. It would also let people chose one or the other or both.
     

    People have already been pretty clear about the way they liked it structured on here. I think Legomatt's analogy (host at a dinner party) sums it up pretty well. You're trying to structure something that doesn't need structure and has worked just fine for the last ~5 years going to the beat of its own drum. If the comments on this thread aren't evidence enough, you'll notice that several of your "general" threads have already filtered off the first page and onto the next page in less than 24 hours. 

    I did not like the idea, hated the way you tried to implement it, but can still appreciate the fact that your primary goal all along was to try and help the community. Similar to Legomatt, no ill feelings here either... time to move on :)
    dougtsSumoLegokiki180703snowhitie
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802

    Apology accepted thanks @legomatt, I agree with what you are saying but although the topic title sounds very eurobricky that is where it ends look at the General Star Wars Discussion it has already gone off on a cantina tangent, this would not be aloud on EB to just let people talk freely and openly.

    I would say its a little hard to get started on the brickset forum and remember that those people wont be here to say anything.

  • samiam391samiam391 A Log Cabin in KY, United StatesMember Posts: 4,299
    ^Which is exactly why it makes more sense to not have a General Star Wars Discussion thread, but rather multiple threads each talking about their own subject matter.

    Let people talk about the cantina thread in one and Red-Five in another. No reason to lump them together.
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802
    samiam391 said:
    ^Which is exactly why it makes more sense to not have a General Star Wars Discussion thread, but rather multiple threads each talking about their own subject matter.

    Let people talk about the cantina thread in one and Red-Five in another. No reason to lump them together.


    NO the point is no one would be talking about the cantina at all if it was not for that topic. None of my topics have gone from the first page of the collecting topic, even the one with no posts as not that many topics have been used today because most people use EB even thou like me they are wrong all the time.

    Sorry for the rant people @samiam391 has hammered me for 24 hours now.

  • samiam391samiam391 A Log Cabin in KY, United StatesMember Posts: 4,299
    edited September 2015
    SMC said:
    samiam391 said:
    ^Which is exactly why it makes more sense to not have a General Star Wars Discussion thread, but rather multiple threads each talking about their own subject matter.

    Let people talk about the cantina thread in one and Red-Five in another. No reason to lump them together.


    NO the point is no one would be talking about the cantina at all if it was not for that topic. None of my topics have gone from the first page of the collecting topic, even the one with no posts as not that many topics have been used today because most people use EB even thou like me they are wrong all the time.

    Sorry for the rant people @samiam391 has hammered me for 24 hours now.

    All I've done is challenge your proposal for better forum improvements with my own proposal for better forum improvements (leaving things the way they are). Essentially, I'm doing the same thing you are, just in a less invasive way. If that's hammering, then you've been hammering your ideas on the entire forum for 24 hours. No, need for you to start playing the victim card like so many people do these days as soon as someone opposes their viewpoint.

    All that being said I'm still a fair player and am content to keep my mouth shut to let your threads have a go which will let the community decide how they want everything run. Just as long as you don't purposely bump your threads like you seemingly have been. That seems fair to me. :)
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802

    I have not been bumping my topics I have been taking part in a discussion, if you plan on bumping your own topic you don't do it 2 minutes after someone has posted because what is the point its already been bumped. If you are going to bump you would bump the topics that are not being used as they are falling down the list. You can see I have not done this. You seem to want to think badly of me and want to have a go at me and you don't stop. Your content to let the threads have a go are you, well that's mighty big of you seeing as it has nothing to do with you. If you think I am bumping my own topics then report it. Please can you stop now.

  • samiam391samiam391 A Log Cabin in KY, United StatesMember Posts: 4,299
    You're being much too sensitive. I'm not (nor am I trying) to attack/"have a go" at you in any way, shape, or form. Honestly, I'm not entirely sure what I'm supposed to "stop". I'm only voicing my opinion, just like you are.
    SumoLego
  • dougtsdougts Oregon, USAMember Posts: 4,129
    legomatt said:

    With regard the headings themselves. Setting up forums is like hosting a party. There's two ways to host a party - invite everyone and trust they sort themselves out, or go about the tables placing topics of discussion on idiot cards.

    The problem with the second is what is meant to help break the ice can, in the hands of the wrong host, become a miserable sterile environment, where the host forgets the original intent of the cards (just to get people going, and then leaving them to it), that host starts demanding that everyone stay in their pre-designated areas and along the topic boundaries, oblivious to the fact that everyone is having a good time.

    To many here, the brickset forum 'party' was already in full swing, and simply didn't need a host suddenly telling everyone where to stand.
    Ding Ding Ding!  We have a winner.  What a perfect analogy. Should be required reading
    snowhitie
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802

    Your making me feel like I cant post in any topics I have made or you will say I am bumping them. In fact I don't feel like I want spend my spare time on the site anymore so you have your wish no more posting at all.

    @Huw Thank you so much for your welcome and the way you handle yourself, this is the reason I liked to spend time here. The site is so nice because it is left to people to talk about what they want without someone stepping in to tell them what they should talk about.

    I know most people will say that is what I was trying to do, to tell people how they should post but I was just trying to create an environment where people would post more because they had a place to just chat about the lines they love. I wanted a place to chat about star wars, dc, marvel and so on. I didn't just want to come on night after night where the only dc talk was about a batpod. 

    People use EB because it is big, because there is always a topic where people are talking about the same things you want to talk about. Brickset doesn't not have that at the moment, it has a few active topics at anyone time which makes it limited. Eurobricks is a horrible site because of the way it is moderated but people chose to go there for a reason and its because it is very active.

    My suggestion was to leave the site as it is but to add two new categories, one would be for mocs although you have a topic you don't have a number of different people posting in that topic by creating a category you would encourage people to post MOCs which would make that part of the site more active and with any luck it would snowball into an active community. I don't MOC at the moment so I was not even asking for something I wanted. I looked at the site and was surprised that there was no encouragement to post a MOC or obvious place to do so. Its not good enough to have a topic if people don't find it.

    The other idea was to leave the collecting category as it was so people could post one off topics as they have always done and to create a new category which would house the general line topics. These topics would be easily accessible for new people, they could find a topic they have an interest in and follow it maybe even for months until they find there way around the rest of the forum which might be harder to navigate but has lots of good and useful topics. It would not only be for new people its nice to have a topic you can follow and read every post, to joke and have fun with the same people every day.

    It was an idea, it didn't mean the loss of anything already on the site. It would just adding something, it might work it might not but the aim would be to gain more members and to make the forum more active. Now if people don't want a more active forum I shouldn't have come here in the first place. You can have different ideas on how to go about making the forum more active but I don't think its right to hide from the fact that a lot of AFOL who use forums don't use the brickset, those people are not here to tell you why they don't use it. I tired to tell you the problems I saw as someone who came to the site years ago but then more on. It seemed like you don't want to hear it but the next time someone tries can you be a little kinder to them, just do as Huw does.

    Thanks all

      

  • TheLoneTensorTheLoneTensor MericaMember Posts: 3,950
    I'm not sure you're aware of this, but you are in the habit of giving lots of suggestions and following none.

    SMC said:
    The site is so nice because it is left to people to talk about what they want without someone stepping in to tell them what they should talk about.

    Indeed.
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 12,565
    edited September 2015
    ^ You know, @TheLoneTensor, if I didn't know better (and perhaps I don't), I'd guess you're in the same line of work as I am.

    People get awfully salty if you quote themselves back to them to illustrate YOUR point, which normally is the opposite of their point.

    Kudos!

    (I'm not sure any of this is a compliment, either.)

    And I completely support a General Fabuland Discussion thread.  I can't seem to find any of those damn keychains!  Only horrible Hungarian knock-offs!
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    edited September 2015
    SMC said:
    samiam391 said:
    ^Which is exactly why it makes more sense to not have a General Star Wars Discussion thread, but rather multiple threads each talking about their own subject matter. Let people talk about the cantina thread in one and Red-Five in another. No reason to lump them together.


    NO the point is no one would be talking about the cantina at all if it was not for that topic. None of my topics have gone from the first page of the collecting topic.

    @SMC. I really think you'll find this thread enlightening (and frankly, it shows this whole discussion is a mountain out of a molehill):

    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/11855/star-wars-2014/p1

    It's a (general, if you like) star wars thread created late 2013, ahead of the 2014 releases. It lasted about a year (most of 2014 - naturally) and is pretty much exactly the thread you've created.

    It was created organically - when there was something to discuss - and people chatted, conjectured, and joked away happily, as info became (or didn't become) available. All done without a fuss. (I won post of the year, and even performed a song... really!).

    It also died when its time was up. Why? The sets had come out and so specific set-based/collection-based issues began to spring up instead, within their respective hobby activity areas and people, and time, moved on.

    There was no attempt, desire, or need to reformat the forum - just a topic to discuss. So clearly, nobody is against such threads. They've happened before. 

    It required no theme subsections or future-proofing to occur, nor similar such placeholders for any and all other potential discussions before their time. When the time is right, and if people want to talk, the topics spring up naturally.

    As briefly mentioned, also in the above quote, the forum does actually already have a structure. It's loosely based around human activity, rather than themes. Shopping, Buying/Selling, Building, Collecting etc. These make more sense. It's a mixing pot of fans chatting about lego with regard to what they do with it/how they obtain it/what they want from it.

    To add extra layers by way of Themes would either require duplicating the entire existing structure multiple times (once over within each theme), or require abandoning the existing structure for a theme based one, which nobody really wants.

    The real problem, as many have mentioned above, is the woeful search functionality. It means discussions which spring back to life after a spell of dormancy - which someone wanted nuked (Oh, my song! how very dare they! ;oD) - have often dropped off the radar by the time the topic revives itself and gets recreated anew, often under a new but similar title. 

    As said, the bugbear is the search function (or not enough mods around to point people in the right direction, sewing more of these threads together... or putting links to and fro new and old ones).

    Regarding the quoted comment: re Cantina.
    The cantina has been discussed in many different ways, in the (general) star wars 2014 thread for one, and later along lines of how to create a good barman (wuher) figure:
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/18132/lego-fat-minifigure/p1
    ...or buying two to make a better build; mocced versions; adding bar clientele, etc.

    The discussion in your thread is actually just people repeating themselves from before. (You may have to trust me on this, I'm too tired to repeat the search).

    Here's a few results from the current search using cantina as a keyword:

    Buying Two:
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/comment/303981/#Comment_303981
    Tusken raiders/troop building:
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/comment/343669/#Comment_343669
    In Summer 2014:
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/comment/297403/#Comment_297403
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/comment/297507/#Comment_297507
    Which star wars figs like to see?
    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/comment/341597/#Comment_341597

    (God, the search function is woeful! There were much better results than those). 

    And here's the kicker, the existence of that previous (general?) 2014 star wars thread didn't render any of the many subsequent and often specific query threads redundant - quite the contrary - they were needed to fit the needs of the people asking them as the issues arose. The danger of imposing 'one-thread-to-rule-them-all'/'one area to discuss a theme' enforcement, is those many specific set/collecting/shopping/building/minifigure/missing-parts, etc general-in-activity but specific-in-set questions that arise would suddenly have no home.

    Even when a general star wars thread existed, specific threads for specific issues still popped up, and they in turn generated their own chat for a bit until they too died off. 

    (Sorry, this is a long post, and i'm too tired to work out if it makes much if any sense any more). Feel free to ignore. :o)
    dougtssamiam391kiki180703SumoLegodrdavewatfordkhmellymelPitfall69snowhitie
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    @SMC My post above was made in response to potentially old information. You appear to have clarified some points above it, which weren't there before. :o)

  • chuxtoyboxchuxtoybox Member Posts: 711
    I just found someone on Eurobricks named SMC who was BANNED and was last active there August 13th 12:52 PM.
  • oldtodd33oldtodd33 Denver 4800 miles to BillundMember Posts: 2,469
    Yeah, but I've heard it's not all that difficult to get banned on EB.
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 12,565
    ^ Nor really relevant.  You can't fault someone for trying to make improvements.

    (Perhaps you can be critical of the method and attitude when trying to make said improvements.)
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    edited September 2015
    I think i'm going to have to read this entire thread again.

    Originally i had the impression theme-based discussion areas were being asked for, at the exclusion of taking that chat outside those areas - an impression reinforced with the recent 'NO! to Cantina/Red 5 options, but keep it under one star wars' exchange above. But quickly scanning smc's last post suggests maybe not?

    There is certainly always room for improvement in most things, and i'm not going to say the forum is perfect. The search function is a state, near impossible to find old threads without digging (even when you know they're there), which is partially why newer members tend to recreate even currently active threads.
    Which may possibly become more of an issue as the membership grows beyond a certain point... or perhaps it's just a perceived issue for those of us who've been here long enough to remember the other threads.

    But the difficulty finding existing discussion isn't helped when there's a surge in quick turnover threads which could've possibly occupied a single stream, instead further burying slow-burning yet ongoing discussions.

    We have (it seems) had something of a thread bloom over the last two years, some good (competitions, community giveaways), some annoying ('please be my financial advisor' type stuff springs to mind), and many others beside. For example, you used to be able to post a trade thread and have it last on the front page of recent discussion for several days, maybe even a week or more. Today you'd be lucky for it to last 24 hours, and probably need to bump it a bit.

    Perhaps the forum is outgrowing itself a little. Or in need of a little re-arranging. I don't know. I'm not in a position to see it from the nuts'n'bolts insides, and don't have any hard facts - merely impressions. I certainly don't want any old threads nuked (there's comedy gold down there).

    Having said all that, the membership also renews periodically. So it's equally possible that none of it even matters, and the forum at any moment in time is merely a reflection of the current active membership, and the topics they're interested in. They don't care that a previous bunch had chatted something to death, they haven't yet, but are about to. The methuselas amongst us can either join in again, link an older thread (if it's recent enough), or let them be.

    Maybe just a few sticky's would've helped in some regards. I can understand the sentiment behind wanting some everlasting threads. But experience has shown that long discussions, even those contained in one thread, have a habit of repeating even within that one thread, as most people don't start from page one once a thread is 20 or 30 or 60 pages long. 

    So even if we had one Star Wars thread, the same chats would start repeating within it every so often (to the possible annoyance of those who'd taken part several times over already). In effect it's no different to the conversation dying off, then being restarted by newer members months later under a new title. It's probably better, in fact, for the new blood to have their new thread, us old hands can take it or leave it without being annoyed that THE ONLY thread is forever plagued by 'people not reading the past 3 years of posts to get up to speed with where we are'.

    The 'miss' is when there's not been enough mod activity to spot a very recent (unnecessary) repeat and maybe stitch them together quickly (or provide a link) occasionally.

    I'm rambling... I'm going to stop.

    Stopped. :o)

  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    Edit: add to 'the miss' paragraph:

    ...but that is perhaps more to do with the increased rate at which topics are now created/drop off and the difficulty finding them, not the fault of mods cleaning up quickly enough.

    :o)
  • DedgeckoDedgecko Seattle, WAMember Posts: 799
    I just found someone on Eurobricks named SMC who was BANNED and was last active there August 13th 12:52 PM.

    kiki180703
  • chuxtoyboxchuxtoybox Member Posts: 711
    legomatt said:


    Perhaps the forum is outgrowing itself a little. Or in need of a little re-arranging. I don't know. I'm not in a position to see it from the nuts'n'bolts insides, and don't have any hard facts - merely impressions. I certainly don't want any old threads nuked (there's comedy gold down there).

    Having said all that, the membership also renews periodically. So it's equally possible that none of it even matters, and the forum at any moment in time is merely a reflection of the current active membership, and the topics they're interested in. They don't care that a previous bunch had chatted something to death, they haven't yet, but are about to. The methuselas amongst us can either join in again, link an older thread (if it's recent enough), or let them be.

    Maybe just a few sticky's would've helped in some regards. I can understand the sentiment behind wanting some everlasting threads. But experience has shown that long discussions, even those contained in one thread, have a habit of repeating even within that one thread, as most people don't start from page one once a thread is 20 or 30 or 60 pages long. 

    So even if we had one Star Wars thread, the same chats would start repeating within it every so often (to the possible annoyance of those who'd taken part several times over already). In effect it's no different to the conversation dying off, then being restarted by newer members months later under a new title. It's probably better, in fact, for the new blood to have their new thread, us old hands can take it or leave it without being annoyed that THE ONLY thread is forever plagued by 'people not reading the past 3 years of posts to get up to speed with where we are'.

    The 'miss' is when there's not been enough mod activity to spot a very recent (unnecessary) repeat and maybe stitch them together quickly (or provide a link) occasionally.

    I'm rambling... I'm going to stop.

    Stopped. :o)

    To me, this is the voice of reason in all of this madness! 

    I do not agree with the way SMC tried to change the forum. If this was my forum, I would immediately ban someone who tried to change things into what they wanted it to be by abusing the liberty to freely post threads. Huw is certainly a more patient man than I.

    However, it seemed like a good time to bring up any legitimate suggestions to "improve" the forum, so I made one. I could have made more but that was the one thing I, as a new member, found, and still find, most annoying. Old threads.

    To the veterans they may seem like fond memories to all who participated in them back in 20 so and so but to the person viewing this forum with "new eyes" it's a lot of irrelevancy that has to be waded through.  I personally don't care what anyone speculated was going to be in series 2 of the CMF line, I want to join in a conversation about series 14 today. 

    It's not only old threads. Why simply close a thread? Why keep a thread created in 2011 that had 0 responses?  Why not do some "house keeping" and simply erase them? Maybe it can't be done. I don't know. Maybe it doesn't need to be done. I'm just voicing my opinion, not trying to pick a fight. 

    I'm just trying to let the veteran's know what it's like to be a newbie, at least what it's been like for me. Hopefully, everyone wants to see new members as long as they are conducive to the forum.

    Overall, I love Brickset. I'm glad it's here. I enjoy logging in everyday possible to find new things having to do with LEGO and LEGO enthusiasts. I love that guy, @SumoLego , who I'm not sure really collects LEGO or who is just here for comic relief. :) 

     
    SumoLegosnowhitie
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    ^ I'm not sure inactive old threads are an actual problem, except perhaps if they were total non-issues or old arguments resurrected accidentally. Though they might clutter already difficult searches, if digging for an old useful thread.

    The forum is a lot like a river, we see what's on the surface, and when it's not too busy, a little of what's below the surface. The nature of the forum is un-posted-to stuff slides to the bottom, forming layers of sediment - it only comes back up if disturbed.

    The more pressing problem (not so bad now, but something to keep an eye on for future) is likely to be the potentially increasing speed at which a thread could sink, as membership rises and more people start competing for air.
     
    From a clear serene surface where every useful thread could be seen, and sinks slowly (and so picked up again easily), we're heading towards a choppy bubbly surface changing quickly and obscuring all, where threads sink fast, and its increasingly difficult to see even immediately below the surface. By that stage, even recent threads can become overwhelmed, as the frequency of posts required to retain visibility increases.
    ricecake
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 18,312
    A big difference between brickset and eurobricks is the structure of collecting / buying selling / shopping. Discussion of sets goes in one place, discussion about availability in another, discussion about their resale value elsewhere. Members have made it clear that they don't want resale discussed in collecting threads for example. If there was a general SW thread, then everything would be in there, with multiple discussions on top of each other, some about one set, some about another, some about selling, some about old minifigs.
    xwingpilotLego_Starkiki180703MatthewlegomattSumoLegosnowhitie
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 18,312
    ^^ I'm not a fan of deleting old threads. There is a lot of useful information in them, even if just historical data for some. Plus it is always funny when someone raises something they think is new when it was discussed back in 2012, and probably before that too. It is also useful just to link back to that thread so those older responses from the past are reread.
    Lego_StarDedgeckolegomattSumoLego
  • legomattlegomatt Member Posts: 2,548
    edited September 2015
    @CCC After reading, I wasn't sure whether you posted those points in isolation (i.e. just throwing in your thoughts too), or posted as a counter to something I'd said above (in which case you'd have me in the wrong camp). 

    So I'm just posting this to quickly quell any potential confusion - we're in agreement. 

    In my earlier rambles i'm pretty clear in my opposition to nuking old threads (for the same reasons you state), and consider the existing format, with individual organically formed threads fit for purpose, far preferable to the eurobricks-type styling and 'master' threads. :o)
  • SumoLegoSumoLego New YorkMember Posts: 12,565
    edited September 2015
    ^  Agreed - I think better forum search options would help.  I must admit that I spent a number of hours reviewing old topics.

    @chuxtoybox - My lovely wife would be quick to point out the sizable amount of bricks, figures and displays at my house and office.  Nonetheless, I view this as a community, and I'm sure my comments annoy as much as entertain, but I am occassionally helpful with the odd bit of Lego information.

    I have as many likes as posts, so it can't all be bad!

    I find EB very stuffy and the beach-themed banner artwork to be creepy and the BL forums are just a turnstile of seller ads.  Most folks here have a healthy respect for the rules and each other.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 18,312
    legomatt said:
    @CCC After reading, I wasn't sure whether you posted those points in isolation (i.e. just throwing in your thoughts too), or posted as a counter to something I'd said above (in which case you'd have me in the wrong camp). 

    I missed an arrow off, it should have been ^^^ in reply to chuxtoybox about deleting / closing threads. I was on my phone, and quoting is hard unless I quote the whole thing and it was such a big quote.
    legomatt
  • chuxtoyboxchuxtoybox Member Posts: 711
    edited September 2015
    @SumoLego : I was just doing some friendly ribbing to try and end my post on a lighter note and hope you didn't take it as a serious insult, though you gave me a "like" so I don't think you did, but I also don't want anyone else to think it was.

    @legomatt: I think you had a moment of clarity which can be seen in your post I quoted, but clearly your talk of rivers and bubbles is  a sign that you've slipped back into a fevered delirium. :) (Once again, friendly ribbing. You can rib me back, I can take it and encourage it.)

    I don't want this site to be EB and never did, but there does seem to be a lot of unnecessary slamming of EB. As I said earlier, in my humble opinion of course, EB is more a site to post MOCs and view excellent MOCs and that's why I became a member of that site.

     I haven't done a lot of MOCs but the few I have posted on there were only met with encouragement from the other members and sometimes members will give you a helpful critique on where you could improve your build.
    (MOC is a funny word when you keep typing it over and over.)

    I'm not saying that members here don't give encouragement to MOCs people post here, or that people don't post excellent MOCs here, just that on EB you generally get more feedback on what people like, or didn't like, about your build.

    It also seems to me that Brickset and a few of it's members actually get a lot of breaking news from EB. I don't know how because I can never seem to find it there myself. :)

    Which brings me to what hopefully will be my final point, I actually find Brickset and Brickset forum a lot easier to "navigate" than EB  the way the categories are currently broken down here. I still have a hard time finding a thread at EB that I was just viewing and want to go back to.

    If I had to pick one, I would pick Brickset and that's the truth, but I don't see a reason why there even has to be an "our site is better than their site" mentality in the first place. :) 
  • SMCSMC UKMember Posts: 1,802
    edited September 2015
    SMC said:

    Your making me feel like I cant post in any topics I have made or you will say I am bumping them. In fact I don't feel like I want spend my spare time on the site anymore so you have your wish no more posting at all. 

    After this I have not posted on this site since but that didn't stop the steam of negative posts about me.

    So let me answer this one first:

    I just found someone on Eurobricks named SMC who was BANNED and was last active there August 13th 12:52 PM.

    Dedgecko said:
    I just found someone on Eurobricks named SMC who was BANNED and was last active there August 13th 12:52 PM.
    Surprised I am not.

    Well to be fair it was a well hidden secret or was it:

    http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/20550/an-open-letter-to-eurobricks-deleted

    If you want to see my last ever post and the one that got me baned:

    http://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=98099&st=8800#entry2261486

    Make your own minds up.

    Can I ask you all to answer a few questions for me (Without looking back at old posts)

    1. What were my suggestions for the site (maybe think about what I wanted to remove)?

    2. What was my first reaction to someone being upset about me starting 7 topics?

    3. What did this post have in common with Huws post the morning after.

    4. How many negative reactions did I get after this post, maybe you can think about some of the things that were said about me.

    5. What were peoples responses when I indicated I was unhappy with my treatment and that I would not post anymore.

    Sorry if my approach comes across badly I am just trying to think of the best way to get you all to consider how you would feel if you were me and how you personally and as a group made me feel and whether it was fair. Also after see that legomatt misunderstood my idea I was wondering how many of you understood what I was saying.

    There have been a lot of reactions on this topic where people including me have posted with emotion, can I ask you to think hard before posting in response to this and I will do the same.

    Thank you for your time.

    SMC (on both site :)


  • plasmodiumplasmodium UKMember Posts: 1,939
    edited September 2015
    I think a lot of Bricksetters like the status quo.  Basically, while Eurobricks is by no means a 'dirty word' round here, it is still regarded with a little distrust by a fair few members here. A lot of the rest would say it's fine, but there's no reason for Brickset to be like it. I think the general feeling is that Brickset is more about Lego itself and collecting, whereas EB is more about the themes and fandoms (and I'm sure many Bricksetters secretly feel as though they are more grown up than EB members, but let's face it - we're all playing with kids' toys here...)

    (If I'm allowed to!) I'd like to apologise for the people who made you feel like you were unwanted - it's just that Brickset has a sort of group/community 'identity' and people felt like that was being threatened. But TBH, starting 7 (or however many) threads wasn't the best way to endear yourself to people who had agreed that 1 test one was worth a shot!

    To play Devil's Advocate a bit here (as in, being critical of Brickset) I feel like a lot of the time, people are told that they should use the search function to find the long-standing threads rather than start new threads. That would all be fine and dandy, but the search function here is fairly rubbish. To clarify, I don't mean that as a criticism of Huw and his team in any way - as I understand, that's part of the Vanilla forum system and I understand that it may be hard if not impossible to change it.
    oldtodd33TheLoneTensordougtssnowhitie
  • TheLoneTensorTheLoneTensor MericaMember Posts: 3,950
    edited September 2015
    ^^ Your approach comes across badly because it's quite narcissistic.  I can't help but feel you want Brickset to be more like you want it, and not for some advertised greater good.  This is also evident in your excessive self-references: "my reaction" "my post" "my suggestions" "I get" "I was" et al.  Plus, you basically ignore everyone who is telling you something different.  You suggest something, then if someone calls you on it, suddenly they are in the wrong and somehow oppressing you.

    There's someone not letting go here nor letting things play out, and it's you.  And no, you taking a mere day off is not "letting things play out."  Relax, let nature take its course and assimilate yourself to the culture - not the other way around.
    dougtssnowhitie
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