Spammed by a user without a reason

nerick906 · August 2014

Hi,
I would not makea thread but I cannot find any policy if similar situation occur.
I contacted one of the mods but he could not help me.

I am receiving a massive amount of spam pins from a user which currently is not really performing on the forum.

http://www.bricksetforum.com/profile/reactions/1081/nerick906?reaction=spam

how do we judge what is right what is wrong ?

regards,
Rafal

Huw · August 2014

We don't seem to be able to remove spam flags. I could ban the user but then he hasn't logged on for a month or so so maybe he's gone away.

bobabricks · August 2014

Seems interesting, he seems to have only spammed comments related to marketplace transactions...

Edit: he logged about 20 minutes ago after this comment was posted.

nerick906 · August 2014

Is it a forums restriction in reversing the spams?
As my profile look totally devastated in regards to that.

david325 · August 2014

nerick906 said:

I am receiving a massive amount of spam pins from a user which currently is not really performing on the forum

Sorry @nerick906‌, I wasn't aware I needed to "perform"

But as it's causing you distress, I've removed the spam flags.

Sorry for any inconvenience caused.

nerick906 · August 2014

You were educated to not refresh old topics which were outdated by 2 years, you could have easily PM a person if you still wanted to try your luck.
That's why you received few spam marks.

Giving it back without a reason was not necessary, when in my matter was the topics that were alive all the time and people were actively selling/trading Lego.

david325 · August 2014

I'm not sure I asked for a lecture about how I was "educated" or should "perform" I've removed the spam flags and apologised.

Taking your own advice, you could have simply PMd me and asked me to remove them. But you didn't.

Pitfall69 · August 2014

I understand both of your points. I had a similar issue with a Bricksetter. I merely PM'd that person and the issue was resolved. At times, we can all be quite obnoxious, but as long as we aren't overly offensive; I don't see how anyone deserves to be "flagged".

rocao · August 2014

Please keep in mind that the "spam" reaction is a useful tool that is intended to primarily be for marking non-LEGO advertising. If a post receives 5 spam votes, it is automatically removed and sent to the moderation queue to be reviewed. In this way, the community can quickly suppress inappropriate content without moderator intervention.

It is not intended to be a mark of general annoyance and definitely should not be used in retaliatory fashion.

margot · August 2014

rocao said:
It is not intended to be a mark of general annoyance and definitely should not be used in retaliatory fashion.

Too bad that's how most people use it. 2 of my 3 spams are retaliatory and one was probably just a mistake.

PeteM · August 2014

I've just noticed that I have one too - no clue why as the post was only asking about the availability of the Exo Suit compared with other Ideas sets. Might try to PM route to find out...

Huw · August 2014

Please also keep in mind that it's probably not worth getting worked up or upset if your posts are marked as spam. Nobody's going to think less of anyone who has spam markers, I am sure.

rocao · August 2014

^ Says the guy with 0 spam. I have 12... and 10 came from @Yellowcastle as a joke :P
But seriously: yes, nothing to get worked up over.

Pitfall69 · August 2014

Huw said:
Please also keep in mind that it's probably not worth getting worked up or upset if your posts are marked as spam. Nobody's going to think less of anyone who has spam markers, I am sure.

rocao said:
^ Says the guy with 0 spam. I have 12... and 10 came from @Yellowcastle as a joke :P
But seriously: yes, nothing to get worked up over.

I don't know, I need all the help I can get and spam markers don't help my cause ;)

dougts · August 2014

rocao said:
^ Says the guy with 0 spam. I have 12... and 10 came from @Yellowcastle as a joke :P
But seriously: yes, nothing to get worked up over.

I tried to mark this post as spam, but the system wouldn't allow it. ;-)

rancorbait · August 2014

dougts said:

rocao said:
^ Says the guy with 0 spam. I have 12... and 10 came from @Yellowcastle as a joke :P
But seriously: yes, nothing to get worked up over.
I tried to mark this post as spam, but the system wouldn't allow it. ;-)

Let me try... ;o)

CCC · August 2014

If you get five spams on one post and the post is automatically removed, it seems the number of spams in the spam counter goes back down to what it was before the post was there. So there is no visible penalty for getting five spams and a post removed. Whereas if you remain at four on one post, they remain on your profile.

Is there a hidden slap on the wrist if you get a post removed?

bobabricks · August 2014

I always think the spam button is a touchy subject because it means "I want this comment removed because it offends me or may offend others". For that reason I use the button very rarely. I do think there should be an in between button just because the two buttons are the two extremes of like and hate. Maybe a disagree button type thing... In the end it doesn't matter because I doubt the admins can change the format of Vanilla Forums.

CCC · August 2014

I think there was a "not like" or disagree button at one stage. I don't think it worked too well.

SuperTramp · August 2014

I don't see the point in having either, think both should be removed.

Legoboy · August 2014

I think there should be 'abuse' and/or 'spam' buttons but I don't think it should be made public when pressed. Only once the counter reaches five and the post is removed should it be made public and be scored against them, not just because one or two have a bee in their bonnet or is playing tit for tat.

Matthew · August 2014

When we first trialled the reactions we had Agree, Disagree, Like, Spam and Abuse. The latter 3 add or subtract one 'point' from the score of a post. When it reaches 5 points it makes the 'Best Of' page, and when it reaches -5 it is buried and sent to a moderation queue. The Agree and Disagree buttons have no tangible effect on a post as they are highly subjective by nature.

In day to day usage, the Like and Agree buttons served much the same purpose so we decided only one was needed. Like was chosen, so agree and also disagree were removed. We retained both the abuse and spam flags until last year IIRC, when abuse was removed as it was causing conflict when people argued that their posts had been flagged and weren't abusive.

As @rocao said above, the spam flag is only intended to be used on genuine spam (a contradiction of terms if ever there was one!) to remove it quickly without administrative action. It does seem at the moment that as the spam button is rarely used for it's intended purpose it may be better to remove it. Alternatively, we do have the option of implementing Dislike or Off-topic reactions. Both of these will bury a post if it gets to -5 points. This is something that we could consider if the community feels that they would be a worthwhile addition and wouldn't lead to increased complaints and tension.

dougts · August 2014

I like the idea of dislike as the counter to like, but absolutely do not like the idea of having those items auto-disappear. off-topic is probably worthwhile, but the problem is that the threads don't have a hierarchy to them, being linear only, so then you would end up with weird scenarios where the responses would still show up after the initial off topic post auto-disappeared.

I guess given all this, my vote would be to retain like, and get rid of spam - the purpose of the spam button can already be accomplished using the "report" option anyway.

Xefan · August 2014

I don't actually really see the point in any of it personally, I can't say I really care if someone likes or dislikes someone elses post, I'd rather judge it on it's merit from my own perspective. Such things seem to exist for no other reason that to encourage group think and clique building, rather than just leaving people to think for themselves. But then, I guess it depends what the goal is - to encourage interesting discussion, or to build an environment where everyone is encouraged to agree with each other on everything always and where challenging existing, and possibly incorrect ideas and understandings is discouraged.

The former will result in more heated disputes but more ideas and interesting discussion, the latter will result in less disputes and more pleasantness but will effectively bar people with new ideas from the forums such that they'll become stagnant. Personally, I've always felt a bit of unpleasantness is an acceptable price to pay for improved knowledge and understanding, but I guess others may disagree - I know some people are far more comfortable when they've got somewhere they can go to have their pre-determined biases reinforced and never challenged.

It's really a fundamental question of what point the forums seek to serve.

BooTheMightyHamster · August 2014

Chalk up another vote for 'get rid of the Like, Spam, and any other buttons you happen to find down the back of the sofa'.

legomatt · August 2014

Disagree/Agree buttons are a bit redundant, and somewhat counterproductive, to an active forum environment, as it turns every post into a poll.
Whether a person agrees, disagrees, or has something to add worth saying, the lack of a button to press encourages them to post their opinion and share their thoughts. But with those sorts of buttons, we'd risk seeing threads developing into only a handful of opening comments, with long lines of lazy 'agree +++++++' and 'disagree --------' clicks. (Which would be a bl**dy eyesore to boot).

A single line of 'likes' is good enough to gauge general approval/enjoyment of a comment - it's roughly the equivalent of people laughing or nodding as you spoke, and exactly like nods and laughs, not overly important to set too much stall by, but nice to notice occasionally.

We don't need a detailed list of critique-based options to clutter up a comment... hmm, what should i vote this one... 'off-topic?', 'this user lives under a bridge and eats goats?', 'post made me laugh?', 'i'm hungry?', 'sausage post?', 'red 5?'... Lego Sets should be reviewed. Not forum posts.

Further to that, if such a thumb could actually 'close' a post, it would only take a few new members to 'not get' the flow of the forum, or a handful of pernickety so and so's taking it upon themselves to play moderator to quickly stifle every light-hearted, jokey comment and organic derailment (which, as with normal conversation, naturally self-right anyway when something pertinent to the topic crops up. And this forum emulates conversation quite well).

So I think the current set up is fine, i'd suggest people just needed reminding what the buttons were for.

The Like button works as a simple catch-all button of general approval/enjoyment, (nobody is going to be offended by a like, so it doesn't matter what you clicked it for).
The Flag - and note, it is a flag - is for drawing attention to actual spam (so that it disappears) and/or reporting abuse (to have the abuser dealt with). Fine when used correctly, but not so good if people mistake flagging a post as a form of 'vote down/disapproval'. Disapproval and 'finger wagging' buttons would just cause irritation, and feel personal, as this thread proves.

There is no 'pitchfork-wielding mob' button, and i think we're a better forum because of it.

BooTheMightyHamster · August 2014

Now I want a pitchfork-wielding mob button...

Matthew · August 2014

Just to clarify, a post will only be buried if it gets to -5 points. This is not the same thing as getting 5 negative votes, as likes will counter them.

bobabricks · August 2014

@Matthew The problem I have been hearing is that those spams get deleted once the comment is "burried". Maybe force editing the comment to a "." or some message saying the comment was "burried" so the user still gets those -5 points...

cheshirecat · August 2014

^ Why does it matter? Does anyone really check how many spam's they've got compared to other forum members?

Keep the like button (it no doubt stops dozens of follow up posts saying 'i agree with ...'), and loose the spam button - I think we've all seen abuse of the spam button. Assuming we have a report/flag button to raise a post to a moderator we're fine. I've always considered we had a good moderating team here so an automatic system to bury bad posts seems unnecessary.

legomatt · August 2014

^ (At time of writing this, there was only @Matthew's spam marker... which made me laugh).

Are we all going to get a good telling off for clicking 'like' instead? :oP
(I can't help it, i'm mischievous by nature).

legomatt · August 2014

^ And my post above now shows exactly how confusing it would be, if posts just disappeared, as it makes absolutely no sense now.

(There was a 'MatthewTest' post, which has been removed).

Matthew · August 2014

@bobabricks‌ the post has now been removed but as you can see the spam marks are retained on the profile - http://www.bricksetforum.com/profile/matthewtest

I have to confess I was actually expecting the below to happen rather than it being removed completely!

Xefan · August 2014

Amusingly I think that example highlights the problem with such censorship tools, the buried post is probably the most sensible answer out the lot. I can't imagine why if you somehow burn yourself cooking all the time you focus on how to deal with the burns, rather than just figuring out why you are and learn to stop burning yourself all the time whilst cooking in the first place!

One person's troll is another person's sensible advice it would seem.

cheshirecat · August 2014

Totally agree, on reading 'I often burn myself cooking' my immediate reaction was 'you're doing it wrong'.

Spammed by a user without a reason

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