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Why is there so much censorship here?
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Like others have said, if you really do not like how you perceive the forum, then don't post, or find another. Much of what i,s and is not allowed, is at the discretion of the moderators and I am fine with that... Heck, sometimes it helps people find their limits when they find their comment redacted, removed, or if a moderator has to interject to keep a thread on topic. Obviously there are certain members on this forum that take themselves WAYYY too seriously and really need to take a look in the mirror, take a deep breath, and count to 10, before posting....
The way (some) people are responding has forced me to hold back from posting knee-jerk reactions, certainly assuring this thread a quick and disappointing death. Perhaps the reason for these accusatory remarks are related to a statement I made that was misconstrued as: the culture in the United States is one of freedom of speech and that in the UK is not. My first PM to @Si_Dorking_Surrey_UK basically asked her to point out where I made this comment. You've seen the results of that request. Now take this comment I just made (starting with 'Perhaps'). Would you call that an "assumption?" Earlier I was accused of making assumptions. Again, @marknam is making this claim without pointing out what the assumption was, but I can only assume ( 8^) that he's referring to other statements similar to this one, where I use the word perhaps ... I take a guess ... something that is most definitely possible, but for which the likelihood is not known. My understanding of assumptions are circumstances where the likelihood of something is 100%, but you make that statement without having actual knowledge of the true result, etc. Maybe pedantic, but such is the life of a math and science geek. And that was too bad, because I think he had one of the, if not THE, best post in this thread. If you had distill all posts down to a single statement, I think this is a strong candidate: So getting back to where I was going with that thought - judging by the number of times I see the word quid thrown around, I'll make the educated guess (also different from an assumption ;) that Brits make up a large constituent of the user population. We even learned that all but two members of the owner/admin/mods are from the UK. Leaving out the comment to cultural differences would most likely have eased up the beat-down I was taking for putting people on the defensive. As I mentioned earlier, the internet is old hat for me. Forum after forum after forum, I've always see the conversation go private when it doesn't concern the entire group. I made the attempt. This person wasn't willing to "$h1t or get off the pot" as they say. And I was HIGHLY aggravated that they felt compelled to unnecessarily re-post their thoughts here. What were their reasons for this? Only they know.
But do you think people will read your comment, asking the person who's thread it is to go somewhere else, and say the same thing to you - "If you don't like what you're reading, pick one of the other hundreds of threads." Most likely not. For reasons only they know. The good thing about threads getting silly is with a little snip, snip here and a remove, redact, lock there - we can be back in action before you can say acrylonitrile butadiene styrene with some dyes on top!
So is this a big enough deal to me that I'd leave Brickset? Not even close. Did I make any new friends in the last day and a half here? Probably not. Do I feel better for getting this off my chest? Absolutely. If the thread were closed right now, not only would I be happy with what it accomplished, but knowing that Huw feels the same way makes up for the few of you out there that posted nasties after being offended by reading into a couple of statements or just plain disagreeing with my observations.
The important thing is, we all get to play with LEGO today! And that makes it worth the trouble.
disclaimer: I'm not referring to you being under 16, @madforlegos...
@Yellowcastle - thanks for returning the title, although I was starting to like the changed version - and to a certain extent, it more accurately reflects what's been talked about. Censorship is an entirely different beast.
p.s. Like most others, my imagination can drift from time to time ... I played out this scenario in my head where on the admin/mod board (which I assume you have) you guys were placing wagers for how long it would take for me to ask that the title be returned :) :) For that reason, I had considered not saying anything... ever... but I made that request this morning before having my coffee, forgetting that I wasn't going to say anything... ever!
Prior to that, you can understand the news coverage being predominantly UK-related given that the site is UK-based and owned.
This is getting out of hand. Please stop it with all these not-so-thinly veiled attacks against the UK. Is the rest of the world not allowed to play on the internet or something? :o)
There is no cultural censorship going on here. The very idea is laughable.
There is absolutely NOTHING on this site that has a predetermined pro-UK agenda, or an anti-US bias, or whatever notion it is that you're tying to suggest. Such insinuations are bordering xenophobic or something worse.
Furthermore, if there is a higher degree of UK based info on here compared with the US-based sites you're more used to, what do you expect? Coming from a UK site maintained by people living in the UK, as much as we might want to tell you all about your Target exclusives, TRU discounts, Walmart bargains, New York Toy fairs, Expos, etc, we CAN'T because we don't LIVE there, and info about that stuff (or anywhere else in the world) will have to be reported in by someone else.
I don't see anything materially wrong with the observation that the news coverage is indicative of having a stronger presence in one geography over another.
That said, the original claim that Americans consider free speech an unalienable right whereas the same might not hold true elsewhere was incorrectly applied to the way this site is governed. As I stated previously, this is a private site and, from the outset, the code of conduct to which all members agree to adhere makes known that transgressions will risk moderator action, which includes editing, closing, removing content.
I'll be steering clear of these 'discussions' in future. It does nothing for my hobby.
Contrary to some of the views expressed, or at least implied, by some forum members, the moderation team fully support and want to encourage robust discussion on this forum - we're all adults, after all. Our view of acceptable free speech does not however extend to "trolling", harassing fellow forum users via the PM system or otherwise spoiling the enjoyment of other people on here.
While we really don't want to have to go around banning people, the forum code of conduct requires forum users to treat each other with respect, and the moderation team won't tolerate behaviour which we believe contravenes this.
So please folks, let's keep the discussions and behaviour civil so that the forum can continue to be a cool place to hang out. Thanks.
Its not like this thread was offering me any additional insight in to any aspect of lego. In fact it just ended up rather boring.
Apparently the OP has not seen some of the new functionalities of Forums these days. As someone (from the American midwest) who posts almost daily on several midwestern urban forum... I have seen relatively new forum features that are now available on many forums (and often used). One feature is one I like to call "Troll-Be-Gone"... where the forum owner (who's too busy to babysit his forum 24 hours a day) simply taps a few keystrokes, and all traces of the offenders posts and threads have disappeared without a trace... including the ability of the offender from posting under any user ID from their IP address.
Coincidentally this feature is especially nice for handling irksome newbies.
I have seen many people disappear without a trace in this manner from several USA forums. So to come out and subtly imply that this is censorship or that this must be a "UK thing" belies the truth in this matter.
Freedom of speech does not apply to forums, nor has it ever. Anyone with 100 posts and at least half a brain should already know that...
I joined because: 1) I want to meet other AFOL and be part of an active and healthy online community; and 2) because I want to engage in lively discussion, which is what a forum is all about, right?
Whilst both these reasons are equally valid, I've begun to realize that they potentially conflict, and that the 'order' in which each of us prioritizes our own reasons for being part of this forum DOES affect how we interact and play off each other, as demonstrated by some of the comments in this thread.
I have a group of friends, who one of which likes to initiate and engage in heated political debate. His arguments are always well thought out & convincing, and I often find myself agreeing with him, such is his level of competency and persuasiveness. I've noticed, however, that he has become increasingly alienated from the group. It seems that as time goes by, people forget (or even care) about the issues and arguments that seemed so crucial at the time. All that remains are the feelings of hurt and resentment that were provoked during the discussions... what I call the 'bitter-after-taste'. It's that bitter after-taste that goes on to colour how the rest of the group interact (or not, as often is the case) with my friend.
I guess what I'm trying to say is this: There is always going to be some conflict where one party values the discussion/debate/getting-to-the truth, more than his or her relationship (and dare I say it, obligation) to the rest of community. In the right setting, this is an extremely admirable and powerful trait, but in the context of a 'community forum', it's probably not. Accordingly, and even though some of our own (and my) responses have lacked sufficient grace, it's not surprising that this thread is so messy when the OP admitted very early on: So back to whole issue of moderation. I'm in favour, more than ever, of strong moderation in the same way I am in favour of having strong rules in a game of football (soccer). Remove the referee and linesmen, and it may be fun for short while, but leave it too long, and the game will eventually descend into chaos.
Perhaps one of the answers to avoiding similar hostility doesn't lie so much with the moderators, but with each individual contemplating his/her motives for being part of this community and choosing not to succumb to the impulse of posting "knee-jerk" reactions, but rather choosing to consider those to which their comments are addressed to first?
Let's try to keep religion (or the lack thereof), politics, or our pet social issues out. These things polarize. Keep it on the brick...
Since this thread is not a marketplace thread... I'll just show you what the new Version 2 LEGO CD looks like... which is actually a Version 1 (1949-80) and Version 2 (1980-90s) compilation... (over 2,000 pages, 1/4 million words, and 2,500 images) and will be ready in a few weeks (it's not my fault that people keep sending me rare images of stuff!!! ;-).... and here's what the CD top will look like when completed (it's amazing how much cheaper a CD can ship for, compared to a book... as little as $1.55 in USA/Canada or $2.55 rest of world)....
http://www.bricklink.com/store.asp?p=istokg&itemID=23123237
So... do you think the CD cover will look OK?
Gary Istok
P.S. In the words of Patricia Rutledge (Hyacinth Bucket)... my 2nd favorite Brit after QE2... "it's so lower middle class to go into details."
'I'm in favour, more than ever, of strong moderation in the same way I am in favour of having strong rules in a game of football (soccer). Remove the referee and linesmen, and it may be fun for short while, but leave it too long, and the game will eventually descend into chaos'.
well put across. I agree. Freedom of speech is very important, but there has to be a line drawn to prevent anarchy. This is still generally a great place to be, and it needs some element of control to stay that way. I have no problem respecting Lego's position on removing links to pics etc, especially if that creates a good relationship with the Company and gives Huw and the team the occasional piece of breaking news.
I think moderating has worked well by complying with legos requests. Lego clearly see Brickset as a big player in lego's universe and worthy of being checked reguarly the websites with the info still up are clearly rubbish and lego dont bother with them. Also the fact that there will be a compeition with lego and @Huw has decribed it as awesome and something he wouldn't want to give up show lego value us and i suspect it was in part a reward for doing as they asked so effectivley
(CD works on all PCs and MACs....)
If all goes to plan I will start the comp. Sunday or Monday.
Employees, helpers and their family are the only people eligible to enter.
Couldn't resist - remove if necessary! :o)