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End of Kingdoms line

RobertoRoberto Imola, ItalyMember Posts: 117
Hi everyone I'm new here and here is the question. As everyone here knows, 2013 will see a change in the castle's brand line and the new one will be called "Castle", simply. The logo's graphic appears to be the same of the previous fantasy line of 2006-2009 years and probably it will have a very similar subject, a more fanciful one. Now I feel like quite confused cause I really enjoied the Kingdoms theme and how it had brought back to life the legendary Lions, Dragons and Black Falcons Knights of 80's Legoland classics. Only TWO years of production, considering the only one set (beautiful Joust) of the last year, and now the line is over, all over. Why turning back to a fantasy-medioeval theme when we already have one, the LOTR ? Hadn't it more sense to offer something different and continuing to develop realistic medieval life's sceneries like they were supposed to be the beautiful MMV, the barn and the mill ones and the castle? Maybe nobody hadn' t appreciated\bought them? What a great universe they promised and how many possible new ideas LEGO could have developed in that line. It's a real pity for me. And I really would like to know if I am the only one who feels himself a little betraied. Thank you and I apologize for my scholastic english (but I'm italian...)

Comments

  • prof1515prof1515 EarthMember Posts: 1,561
    The LOTR/Hobbit sets are fantasy but of a better build design than these upcoming castle sets. The latter are probably targetting a younger demographic with blockier designs and a more dumbed down theme. It is a shame since the Medieval Market Village and Kingdom Joust are extraordinary sets.

    P.S. - Your English is fine. :-)
  • MasterLegoMasterLego Banned Posts: 38
    I guess the "Castle theme was very popular and there is a large enough demand for them to come back. Honestly, on of the new sets looks exactly like an old one.
  • RobertoRoberto Imola, ItalyMember Posts: 117
    Yes but also in a couple of years they will have a new large enough demand for MMV and Joust similar sets and so what they are supposed to do? Come back to Kingdoms again doing something schizofrenic ? They surely have their marketing reasons for coming back to that genre. Maybe I'm a nostalgic but I'm sure Kingdoms had a lot of potential, unexpressed. Thank you prof1515 for appreciating my english.
  • RobertoRoberto Imola, ItalyMember Posts: 117
    prof1515 said:The LOTR/Hobbit sets are fantasy but of a better build design than these upcoming castle sets. The latter are probably targetting a younger demographic with blockier designs and a more dumbed down theme. It is a shame since the Medieval Market Village and Kingdom Joust are extraordinary sets.

    P.S. - Your English is fine. :-)


    Probably LOTR\Hobbit sets are really fantastic sets as many say. Unfortunately, being already a city\modular buildings\star wars 4-5-6\castle collector I can't afford a fifth collection. It seems this year I will save much money thanks to the new castle line.
  • DMoCTTADMoCTTA Member Posts: 2
    Really popular theme so it's not surprising it was called back. If you don't want to be a pirate or an indian than you'd want to be a Knight. I know I'm still in love with Knights Kingdom II
  • StuBoyStuBoy New ZealandMember Posts: 623
    I wish they did something like they did back in the late 80s/early 90s, where there was a continuation of the theme and new factions were introduced or dropped out. I'm thinking Black Knights, Black Falcons, Lion Knights, with Forestmen and Wolfpack making short appearances.

    At the very least overlap the new theme with the old, maybe replacing the old Dragon Knights with the new ones this year, then the Lion Knights next year.

    We'll have to wait and see when we get some better quality pics of the sets. The new Castle looks big, but its probably mostly wall panels. And that catapult thing looks terrible! Like some kind of medieval car.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,003
    edited January 2013
    ^ Maybe they will take note of what worked well in Ninjago. A fixed core of characters that had new variants each year, then a completely different wave of enemies each year. It keeps the line fresh, but there is also continuation. It could work exactly as you say - one year appearances for each faction.
    StuBoy
  • prof1515prof1515 EarthMember Posts: 1,561
    I think that's the problem though, CCC. They DID take note of what kids like in Ninjago, namely unrealistic, gimmicky, gamey vehicles and sets. That's why Chima has it too and it looks like, at least from the fuzzy pictures, that hese new castle sets run in a similar vein.
  • icey117icey117 DenmarkMember Posts: 506
    But, isn't these three set surposed to be the "re-release" of former sets. Some month ago there were news about "Legends". Are those sets different from these castle sets we are watching leaked pictures from... or are they the same? I think these are the rerelease of older sets... if not slightly revised. But I might be wrong!

    Also... Lord of the Rings is not "Castle" in classic sense... it's much too advanced in storyline/building/character to satisfy a 8 year old boy with a kick on many knight-sets.
  • prof1515prof1515 EarthMember Posts: 1,561
    Perhaps it's a re-release of crap like #8779.

    8779 - The Grand Tournament
    StuBoyTitus
  • piratemania7piratemania7 New EnglandMember Posts: 2,129
    I think with the "ending" of kingdom's we may see the theme simply on a hiatus of sorts. Similar to what we have been told with the classic pirates theme. Although, castle as a whole is one of those staple themes that will always be around. ( At least this is what LEGO says ). So I assume we will just see this go out as a wave and maybe be replaced in a year or two with an updated one? But I think we are all overlooking the fact that LEGO has a core demographic of 8 - 13 or 14 year old boy's. They are not catering to the AFOL's out there. Thats what the modulars are for! I am an AFOL and huge castle fan, but even I understand the business model of a successful international company. There are a lot of things we dont get that LEGO does but they do it and we always seem to go along with it. :)

    I think LOTR/The Hobbit theme will be more successful than say POTC, because so many people love the movies, they do have that fantasy theme/idea to them and they still relate to castle, albeit in a pretty distant fashion. We will have to wait for some better pictures to be released of this year's castle, I will probably pick up the line just to have and stay current with castle, but as I have read above, nothing seems entirely and hugely impressive...yet.

    Lastly, this idea of returning to some sort of "legends" theme. LEGO first did this, when? Back around 2000/01? They rereleased legends of all major themes and some of the most successful sets ever released. As most of us know, or who read these blogs that was not as successful as LEGO had hoped it would be so they may be quite timid to go back to such a thing. I furthermore doubt they would cater a legends theme just around a single theme, even if it is castle. They may "update" or "recreate" a castle or horse and buggy but I think we should see entireyl new concepts and design.

    Happy Building!!
  • mathewmathew Member Posts: 2,098
    ^ People think just because the Legends theme wasn't successful back in 2000 that it wouldn't be successful today. There are probably 100x as many AFOL today as there were 12 years ago. A lot of those classic castle sets go for good money on ebay (see the yellow castle).
  • m4ttym4tty Member Posts: 54
    has any one got anything good to say about the 10223 kingdoms joust, is it worth £99.99,i understand you get around 1500 pieces 9 minifigs and its a LEGO exclusive ive got the mmv and some other castle sets so i was thinkin about getting it,is there any chance it could go up quite well when it goes EOL or should i just wait and try to get it cheap ? thanks
  • mathewmathew Member Posts: 2,098
    ^ Joust is a pretty good set for around $100. I think it's a little over priced at retail. It's a great display piece. I'm not crazy about the actual jousting section so I incorporated the castle portion with MMV. The combined sets looks great on a shelf. Most people complain that the castle is incomplete which is true but it gives you access to the back and it also keeps the overall cost of the set lower.
  • prof1515prof1515 EarthMember Posts: 1,561
    It's an excellent set and I'd place it only second to the Medieval Market Village in terms of medieval Lego sets.
  • tfranklin84tfranklin84 Member Posts: 103
    Yes, Joust and Medieval Market Village are the cream of the crop with medival themed sets from my standpoint, as an adult Lego lover. I would love to see more realistic civilian themed medival era sets.
    icey117
  • MatthewMatthew Cheshire, UKAdministrator Posts: 3,734
    I think the Legends business came from a toy shop who didn't know what category to put the new sets into, so found the Legends logo online and used that. These sets seem to be in the same vein as older stuff, but considerably poorer than Kingdoms and even Fantasy Era, IMO of course.
    StuBoy
  • Si_UKNZSi_UKNZ NZMember Posts: 4,179
    edited January 2013
    RE earlier posts
    MMV is Castle but not Kingdoms, so you could see this new Castle line as a continuation of that.
  • RobertoRoberto Imola, ItalyMember Posts: 117

    RE earlier posts
    MMV is Castle but not Kingdoms, so you could see this new Castle line as a continuation of that.

    This is only partially true, cause yes it came under "castle" logo line, but definitely it was in syntony more with kingdoms than with fantasy era. It was in fact depurated from every single fantasy element of the previous line. Only two (or three, now I don't remember) king's guards neither too important in the overall concept.
  • StuBoyStuBoy New ZealandMember Posts: 623
    Matthew said:

    I think the Legends business came from a toy shop who didn't know what category to put the new sets into, so found the Legends logo online and used that. These sets seem to be in the same vein as older stuff, but considerably poorer than Kingdoms and even Fantasy Era, IMO of course.

    I've also come to this conclusion - I think the new sets were just categorised wrong on that website, and got everyone thinking the new line was a Legends line, which now seems to be false.
  • yys4uyys4u USA SoCalMember Posts: 1,092
    ^I've heard this too and agree with it, but sone people on this forum mentioned thay ONE set will be a remake and the rest will be new. I wonder where this idea came from?
  • StuBoyStuBoy New ZealandMember Posts: 623
    ^Yes, I remember that too. I think it was from a Lego statement about the new line.
  • binaryeyebinaryeye USMember Posts: 1,734
    yys4u said:

    ^I've heard this too and agree with it, but sone people on this forum mentioned thay ONE set will be a remake and the rest will be new. I wonder where this idea came from?

    This rumor may have stemmed from the name of one of the new sets being King's Castle.
  • prof1515prof1515 EarthMember Posts: 1,561
    Surprise! It's a new Lego license featuring Nathan Fillion's TV show.

    (Note to the naive: I'm kidding)
  • carlqcarlq Ruislip Manor, MiddlesexMember Posts: 792
    ^ Shame! I'd buy sets based on that show (closest I'd get to an official Firefly minifig....;-)
  • OldfanOldfan Chicagoland, IL, USAMember Posts: 648
    roberto said:

    RE earlier posts
    MMV is Castle but not Kingdoms, so you could see this new Castle line as a continuation of that.

    This is only partially true, cause yes it came under "castle" logo line, but definitely it was in syntony more with kingdoms than with fantasy era. It was in fact depurated from every single fantasy element of the previous line. Only two (or three, now I don't remember) king's guards neither too important in the overall concept.
    Well, those MMV guards were certainly from the "fantasy" Castle line and not Kingdoms, and the packaging graphics indicate the fantasy theme as well. But everyting else about the MMV is generic enough to fit in well as the "civilian" component of just about any Castle theme...
  • HardradaHardrada Member Posts: 439
    roberto said:


    This is only partially true, cause yes it came under "castle" logo line, but definitely it was in syntony more with kingdoms than with fantasy era. It was in fact depurated from every single fantasy element of the previous line. Only two (or three, now I don't remember) king's guards neither too important in the overall concept.

    It was still a Fantasy Era Castle set and not a Kingdoms one. Also it fitted into the FE perfectly. That theme had a human faction, too.

  • piratemania7piratemania7 New EnglandMember Posts: 2,129
    All of the above is a very interesting discussion; I think MMV and Kingdom's Joust have been special for a few reasons:

    LEGO has released them almost as their own entity; in other words, part of a broader line of castle/kingdom/fantasy but also as stand alone sets. The appeal here is that you get a lot of parts for not a lot of money and the set's themselves are marvelous. I would also argue that these two sets are a couple of the best in many years.

    Also, I think kingdoms did well after fantasy, but it has been what? A good year or so since we have had anything concrete, other than the Joust of course. So maybe this summer when the new line comes out we can all buy them and reminisce over the good ol' castle days. Until then, lets enjoy the MMV and Joust for all their glory!
    OldfanStuBoy
  • tfranklin84tfranklin84 Member Posts: 103
    I agree, MMV and Joust are special sets. I hope Lego uses them for inspiration for years to come with Castle or Kingdoms related sets. The Mill Village Raid is a neat set from that era, too. Though I've not built it yet, only stared at the box.
  • RobertoRoberto Imola, ItalyMember Posts: 117

    I agree, MMV and Joust are special sets. I hope Lego uses them for inspiration for years to come with Castle or Kingdoms related sets. The Mill Village Raid is a neat set from that era, too. Though I've not built it yet, only stared at the box.

    Mill village raid is a very good set, believe me. Maybe not fatastic like the MMV, but well constructed and perfectly assorted with this last one.
  • odueckodueck Member Posts: 48
    I didn't realize Kingdoms Joust was so well loved. I recently picked up MMV and now have my eye on Mill Village Raid. I don't think Lego makes enough of these civilian castle sets but it's understandable that they may not appeal to kids as much.
  • mathewmathew Member Posts: 2,098
    ^ MVR is not nearly as detailed as MMV or Joust. I personally like the little mill, but the barn itself is not very interesting except for the weather vane and sun flower.
  • korkor Member Posts: 392
    It seemed to me that MVR was only on the shelves for about 4 or 5 months before it was gone. Perhaps my recollection is off but the life of that set was very short, maybe the shortest I've seen.
  • dougtsdougts Oregon, USAMember Posts: 4,129
    ^ no, it definitely had a very short shelf life
  • OldfanOldfan Chicagoland, IL, USAMember Posts: 648
    ^I saw it on the shelves at TRU for much longer than that, including a few months on the clearance rack (Vernon Hills, IL, USA)
  • mathewmathew Member Posts: 2,098
    Oldfan said:

    ^I saw it on the shelves at TRU for much longer than that, including a few months on the clearance rack (Vernon Hills, IL, USA)

    It was heavily clearanced post-Christmas last year. I just missed the boat on it and wound up paying RRP from B&N. Overall, a nice set, but not terribly exciting.
  • StuBoyStuBoy New ZealandMember Posts: 623
    ^Also some nice animals that go excellent with MMV. That printed horse is very cool and unique to the set.
  • tfranklin84tfranklin84 Member Posts: 103
    I ended up paying $90 for MVR for a new copy on ebay a month or so ago. I know that's probably a bit high (especially considering I only paid $90 for MMV), but I love these civilian themed sets, and they are so few and far between. Too bad war and violence appeal to kids more than a peaceful life!(wait, something seems backwards here...)
  • andheandhe UKMember Posts: 3,112
    StuBoy said:

    ^Also some nice animals that go excellent with MMV. That printed horse is very cool and unique to the set.

    As well as the printed pig, goats and white chicken.

    I'm surprised we haven't seen the goats and chickens turn up in anything else yet, even a city set. Guess they don't fit with the current fire fighting obsession.

    Personally the MMV is a far superior set to the MVR, in build terms, and general fan reaction. MVR built up such hopes for the Kingdoms line, only for it to end abruptly.

    Looking forward to seeing official, non-preliminary images of the 2013 stuff.

  • PaperballparkPaperballpark UK / KLMember Posts: 3,804
    I want MVR mainly for the animals which are unique to the set (goat, chickens, printed pig and horse), but tbh I'd probably balk at paying even the RRP for it (£67), let alone what some resellers are asking. It's a nice looking set and all that, but I don't want it enough to pay £100+ for it.
  • cheshirecatcheshirecat Member Posts: 5,332
    edited January 2013
    ^Given that on bricklink you can buy the chickens (either colour) for less than £1, the pig for less than £2 and the goat for less than £3 and the horse for just over £2 (although its now largely redundant imo due to the new design) I'd suggest that route.
  • CCCCCC UKMember Posts: 19,003
    edited January 2013
    If you want a lot of pigs for a farm MOC and don't mind non-lego pieces, brickforge have a sale on their pigs at 50c each. The only have white (58) and pink (124) left now. They probably won't last long. Their parts are good quality - I've always been impressed with them. They are not lego though of course, which will matter for some.

    http://www.brickforge.com/store/home.php?cat=304

    Including postage, you can get 39 of them for £15.80, so about 40p each. Handy if you need a lot.
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