Rumours about Star Wars UCS models

monkeyhanger

mathew said:

I agree that should the Lego investment bubble burst that its intrinsic value as a building toy will remain. Yet, you won't be able to just sell the loose bricks and assume that you can get back your initial investment.

Erm...I think you will be able to just sell the loose bricks and get back what you paid. As many bricklinkers will attest to, the average price of collective parts for a set bought from new is generally lower than the same total to bricklink the parts for that set. Seeing as Lego parts can be used for many other MOCs/sets, whatever you want to build, there will always be a market for those pieces no matter what the intended build is. Lego's versatility to be able to use those parts to build anything and the relative rarity of certain parts all help keep the used values up. Construction toys are unique in that respect. Buy almost any other toy and once it is used it is generally worthless. Lego is one of the few things that you can use and reuse then sell on for practically what you paid for it (at minimum). There any people that buy absolute dogs of sets on sale purely for the parts, either for themselves or for their bricklink store.

You seem to relish the potential demise of reselling, as a result of this reissue. For me resellers are a great asset. If you have the means (and the will to spend that much), you can get hold of long discontinued sets. If resellers didn't exist, you wouldn't be able to buy a UCS MF for £1000, you wouldn't be able to buy one at all. I don't see any poor morals in the act of reselling, just sour grapes that sets you may like to acquire could be out of your financial reach or beyond your will to spend that much. Should resellers not exist at all so you can't get hold of an old set, or should they hoard sets to pass off at RRP forever more like some guardian angel of Lego collecting?

There are a few times when the redo is inferior to the original. It would seem that even if TLG got it right first time, they are obliged to make changes to a redo so that it seems something new. Looking at the front end of the new Khettana, and the nose of this new UCS X-wing I would say that these have suffered as a result of TLG trying to be different to the original, but not finding a way to improve upon it.

dragonhawk

Since I do not own the UCS X-Wing, I can definitely see the appeal of this set to fans and TLG as a business.

I am not as excited about the Ewok Village. Probably because I detest Ewoks even when I first watched RotJ during my youngling days

LegoFanTexas said:

George was perhaps too close to it, I'm interested in the spin-off movies as much as anything else.

If Han and Boba get their own movies, if done right, those could be very sweet indeed.

Disney has done very well with Marvel the past few years, no reason they can't do the same here.

I would rather they make the Padawan Menace II and continue the adventure of "Ian". To be honest, the spinoffs should be rather light hearted affairs and not concern too much about the war aspect of "Star Wars".

Bandit

y2josh said:

^Even though I'm all for the Ewok Village and have been wanting TLG to make it for awhile, I'm not sure it would be able to rival 10188 in terms of popularity or versatility. 10188's biggest strength is that it can pull from two movies and several key scenes to populate the structure with features and minifigs. An Ewok Village, short of somehow incorporating every scene on Endor, is going to be fairly limited in terms of what it can do and which characters it can include.

I'll tell you what figs it can include. Ghost obi wan, ghost anakin, and ghost yoda. Boom. Your move TLG.
;)

SirKevbags

^^ I like the idea of several sets designed to work together and purchased gradually. However with #8038 being so recent I think its unlikely a bunker would be included...... Unless it was to happen two years from now.

LegoFanTexas

dragonhawk said:

I am not as excited about the Ewok Village. Probably because I detest Ewoks even when I first watched RotJ during my youngling days

RotJ, when Teddy Bears finally defeat the Empire! :)

dragonhawk said:

I would rather they make the Padawan Menace II and continue the adventure of "Ian". To be honest, the spinoffs should be rather light hearted affairs and not concern too much about the war aspect of "Star Wars".

If they do a Han movie, I'd like to see him free Chewie from slavery and see the life-debt process, as well as him meeting Lando and obtaining the Falcon for the first time.

If you read the old Han novels from long ago, he actually used to be an Imperial Officer, but when he saw how Chewie was treated, he freed him and fled with him, that is where the life-debt came from.

I don't recall if that has been ret-conned or not in latter books, but the very first books before the Zahn books, that was the story.

LegoFanTexas

Bandit said:

I'll tell you what figs it can include. Ghost obi wan, ghost anakin, and ghost yoda. Boom. Your move TLG.
;)

Instant classic! That would indeed go over very well... :)

Vortex

^ yeah my eyes just twinkled .

Bumblepants

Personally, I was really disappointed with #8038 and just didn't enjoy building it very much. I am curious to see what the Ewok Village will look like but I do not expect it to be something I will be eager to get. I would rather get a Kashyyyk Village and have a Chewie tree fort with a bunch of Wookiees, perhaps his wife, son, and the pervy grandpa from the holiday special? Of course that won't happen but Wookiees > Ewoks is what I am trying to say.

CCC

Bandit said:

I'll tell you what figs it can include. Ghost obi wan, ghost anakin, and ghost yoda. Boom. Your move TLG.

I'm working on doing blue fluorescent minifigs right now...

CCC

emmtwosix said:

Umm, last I checked "greed" was a vice, not a virtue, right? I love resellers too (most of them), but a few exemplify the precise definition of greedy. Just look at some of the "Buy It Now" prices on eBay.

Unfortunately, I feel like this trend is on the upward slope and our hobby is being somewhat hijacked by investors who couldn't care less about Lego, only profit. As long as resellers continue to have an interest in the hobby, and a little bit of a conscience, we'll be fine.

I don't see the problem with that type of investor - just as I don't with the resellers with a heart / conscience.

Those resellers are not going to stop you or any other reseller buying stock. If they want to list at high prices, let them. If resellers with a conscience have stock, then they will be listing at lower prices, meaning that there is still a secondary market which is priced fairly (whatever that means). It is only if all resellers decide not to have a conscience that there is a problem. If the last reseller that has a conscience and all others have sold, then would he put his prices up towards the bad ones? Probably.

I just don't see that resellers without a conscience can be bad for a hobby. If they want high prices, higher than anyone is willing to pay, then they will not sell anything. The buyers will all be buying from resellers with a conscience.

richo

^ I agree. Apart from perhaps catching out the odd poorly informed person, people holding out for very high prices are also paying for it themselves with inventory costs and constant relisting fees. I don't generally get too bothered about the ethics of different resellers. I trust the free market, and it generally finds a level.
These discussions remind me a little of something a good friend of mine in the financial services industry always says. 'there is no such thing as a completely ethical investment'. If you want to be very conscious and ethical, make as much money as you can then give some profits to charity.

Bosstone100

I don't buy the whole "if it wasn't for resellers, you couldn't get old sets" argument. You may not be able to get new MISB sets but there will always be a secondary market for used sets. Not everyone on ebay is a reseller. They may just be looking to make some extra $$$ for the junk they have lying around the house.

CCC

^ So what if you wanted a new copy?

cheshirecat

Guys, lets get back on topic rather than reverting back to the old reseller debate - its all been said before and there are other places for saying it again.

rocao

I think we've had a sufficient tangent about reselling and would appreciate it if anything further would be posted in: http://www.bricksetforum.com/discussion/7043/why-so-much-anger-towards-resellers-an-honest-question

CCC

I didn't get the original, so I'll probably get this. I'd say it is wanted by the fans - it is an iconic ship and anyone new to the hobby in the last ten years probably doesn't have the original, so might want to be able to get a large scale X-wing at a reasonable cost.

I wonder what the worst option is for people that already have it. Either a remake, with revised and up to date parts, or a complete reissue.

Legoboy

^^ I agree, although with one now confirmed and the one other being a dead certain, aren't we now done for SW UCS rumours during 2013? Or are neither actually UCS? The thread went stale a while back. Anybody any other rumours to add?

LegoFanTexas

^ Is Ewok Village supposed to be the second UCS set? Will it have a black display plaque?

I get the impression that it is a play set, not a display set. I think we're due for a large display set in October... Hmm, UCS Sandcrawler!!! :)

doriansdad

As a reseller this new X-Wing is great. It is certainly going to draw alot of folks out of their dark ages and will be in heavy demand once it EOLS. I think it will get alot of folks into their physical Lego stores with it displayed in the window. It is at the perfect price point to get folks to open their wallets. As a collector tho it really stinks. I can understand the system scale rehashes but the UCS name for me really took a hit with this rehash. I know TLG is not in the business of selling collectibles so ultimately I can understand the decision.

rocao

@Legoboy: yeah the topic progressed into X-wing discussion. I thought about splitting it into a new topic (and may still) but it was a natural progression from the rumor stage. The reselling tangent was a lot more about an axes to grind.

CaptAPJT

If the Ewok village is a play set, so not officially a UCS will there be a second UCS release this year?

rocao

streeker said:

No, I think I used the proper context: the huge amount of pent-up demand shown by ownership versus desirability -- a clear 100% increase between the two. Of the top ten Most Wanted Sets, only Cafe Corner and Sandcrawler comes close, and that at a distant 25% increase,

Normally, I would agree with you that clicking 'want' doesn't necessarily mean 'buy' for any other set, but this is the Millennium Falcon, most iconic ship in the Star Wars universe, the one that people really regret not owning.

Let's look at the context of its release and discontinuation. It was the first set to hit $500, and in 2007, that price was unheard of, crazy even. LEGO has weaned us really well because after that first hard pill, a $400 SSD and $400 Death Star are much easier to swallow now, aren't they? And in comparison to the $2,000 that is the going rate for a new 10179, that initial $500? Peanuts, a right bargain, and why if offered for purchase today, a similar USC-type MF would be an automatic buy rather than just a wistful 'want.'

The 'want' figure represents desire, and isn't a complete picture of economic 'demand' which is the desire AND ability to buy. When DrDave mentioned modest sales, it was a result of actual demand at the time and not desire after it's retired, which is why I said more context was needed.

The Millennium Falcon's iconic position in the Star Wars universe didn't change between 2007 and now, so I don't think that alone can justify why a redesign or reissue would be a better seller this time around.

What's different now, as you say, is that people have seen it reach $2000 on the aftermarket and they've adjusted their value of such a set. Surely a segment of the market will keep this in mind and definitely jump on a re-release, but it won't be everyone.

The re-release will not have an instant $2000 value. The promise of that future valuation isn't certain. 10179 aftermarket prices will sag due to the new alternative and some will say that it never should have been valued that high. In the end, for many it will be yet another high cost set that for one reason or another they're never quite able to pull the trigger on.

I do agree that a comparable re-release will do better than the original 10179. But even though 10179 is the most wanted and has the highest want:own ration by far on Brickset, it's very unlikely to sniff a top 10 rank in annual highest grossing sets.

richo

I notice we are already seeing a few extra UCS Falcons come out of the woodwork now for sale. To be fair, if I had some for sale I would be doing the same given the much greater risk of re-issue sooner rather than later.

streeker

I think we agree more than we disagree, but in the main, I am not at all concerned about

rocao said:

The re-release will not have an instant $2000 value. The promise of that future valuation isn't certain.

If I'm lucky enough to be able to have the opportunity to purchase a rehash of 10179, the last thing on my mind would be, "Wow, this is going to be $2000 six months after EOL.¨

I'm going to be thinking (and I suspect many others who similarly missed out), ¨Thank you, LEGO, for giving me another chance to afford this, so that I don't have to spend thousands of dollars on 10179.¨

No, the USC line will never be the top selling line in volume. It can't be. It's a boutique niche. But for its core customer, us rabid AFOLS, it will be the most coveted.

jockosjungle

Can't see the Ewok village being a UCS, with the trees needed, I just can't see it looking good enough, unless they make the imperial base the major feature of it

bellybutton290

If the ewok village has a decent AT-ST then it's a certain purchase for me. I have been disappointed with every system scale AT-ST to date.

rocao

^ Yep, I agree that we mostly agree :)

The reason I stated that it won't be worth $2000 immediately wasn't to suggest that it would be the primary reason to buy it. Rather, I was countering your assertion that $500 would be "peanuts, a right bargain" such that it would be an automatic buy.

I think for some it will be, but most will wait for double VIP points or hold out for discounts from other retailers which won't come until well into its product life. Then it will catch people off guard and retire and we'll be right back where we started :P

streeker

$500 vs the $2,700 being listed in the latest Marketplace? I don't mean to offend the person selling his set, but if he offered his 10179 for $500, you bet for me that would be an ¨automatic buy.¨

I do agree people will wait for a sale or double points or another promotion. Five hundred dollars or whatever price LEGO is going to peg this imaginery rehash is still going to be a lot of money. It is for many families, mine including. But my automatic buy doesn't mean buying it on release day; it means definitely buying it when you can rustle up the cash, when there is a sale and not totally dismissing as a 'crazy price, who would pay that?' 10188 has taught me well.

And yes, the cycle will continue. We can't always get what we want. Life is more fun that way.

Bandit

Think about this. The first edition falcon was limited to what, 10,000? 15,000? Did we ever figure out the actual number? (What's the highest number we've ever seen? Mine is 2,000 something, and I preordered the first day).

Anyway, it took a LONG time to sell out of those first editions. They were available forever, especially when you consider the preorder was 8 months before shipping. So they sold say, roughly 10,000 that whole first year, if that. And that was to the hardcore collectors, the guaranteed buyers. Who was left after that? A few new to the game AFOLs or late to the party SW collectors? No way they sold that many per year in the years after.

The point is, I don't think they made very many of these in the first place, I don't think it sold well (although it may have met TLG expectations -- remember they took preorders 8 months before release, so they knew how many to produce, at least at first) and if they remade it, it would likely sell even worse, as many of the people who already bought one wouldn't buy another (and I don't think the number of new buyers would displace the old buyers). The one wildcard would be resellers, who would presumably buy a ton more stock this time around.

y2josh

I mentioned this in another thread but, I'm not sure an Ewok Village would be able to rival 10188 in terms of popularity or versatility. 10188's biggest strength is that it can pull from two movies and several key scenes to populate the structure with features and minifigs. An Ewok Village, short of somehow incorporating every scene on Endor, is going to be fairly limited in terms of what it can do and which characters it can include. And, as @BrickDancer mentioned, the Death Star is also very easy to display given the small footprint. So, even if this is the replacement for the Death Star, I don't imagine it will have nearly the same shelf life.

y2josh

LegoFanTexas said:

Bandit said:

I'll tell you what figs it can include. Ghost obi wan, ghost anakin, and ghost yoda. Boom. Your move TLG.
;)

Instant classic! That would indeed go over very well... :)

Sure. Until the ghost Anakin is a Hayden minifig...

graphite

^ lol

CCC

y2josh said:

An Ewok Village, short of somehow incorporating every scene on Endor, is going to be fairly limited in terms of what it can do and which characters it can include.

Plus we have five decently detailed ewok minifigs already. If they are re-released, I'd probably avoid it and just BL any missing minifigs. Who else would be in there? C3PO on his throne and Han Solo on a spit?

y2josh

^This is why I'm saying as something to replace the Death Star, it really needs to be every scene from Endor more than just the village. The landing platform is really the only way you can work any iconic villain into the set (Vader), but even as all four key scenes/areas, I still can't see it pushing ~30 minifigs... unless you throw in like ten stormtroopers... which I'd actually be ecstatic over.

Picopirate

A whole planet series with similar construction as the death star could be neat. Have a different planet with all scenes from that planet depicted. However Tatooine, Naboo and Coruscant are probably the only ones with enough scenes to pull off.

itsnotme

gofigure19 said:

was the Lego FB post about the new X-wing on Friday a bit of foreshadowing?? "So we were thinking- what would be the best way to destroy the Death Star.... "

Strikes me as significant. Surprised there hasn't been more conversation around that comment.

morbiczer

I have no idea how reliable the rumour is, but it says that Ewok Village would be a big playset to replace 10188 Death Star. Meaning no UCS.

Then again, I have read here and there a rumoured price of ca. 200 USD, which clearly would make it much smaller than 10188.

emmtwosix

When I hear "Ewok Village" 10xxx-series set, I keep thinking Cloud City, only bigger, probably a lot more so. Anyone else get this feeling?

lordofthebatcave

Personally I would more "advanced" sets for many themes. But with Star Wars the "Super" Star Destroyer, I was so let down :'( lol. :). Seriously though, one thing about collecting Legos is when you spend alot of money on a large set, and at first the Minifigures in the set, aren't featured in other sets. It makes that Large Set seem special, and justifies paying alot for it. I know some care more about builds, than minifigures but for me, its that marriage of both the build and the minifigures that make the set, in my opinion. But it makes me feel salty when the Set you pay alot for, the minifigures eventually are released in small sets. lol Which it makes sense why Lego would do it, to give the younger Audience a chance to own them but still :P. I wish there would be a new Vader Face already lol. :| <---Vaders face for the last few years. I do wish Lego would do "One Of A Kind" minifigures for these sets, and can only be found in them, not release them in other sets. Like the Super Star Destoyer should have come with a really detailed Boba Fett, and a Vader with a different face than the ones in other sets. A few details like white dots in eyes isn't enough lol :D. ;) jk

CaptAPJT

If I'm honest the only mini figures I care marginally about are those in the planet sets and only because they fit well with the name plate and mini model to display well. I guess I could make something to display the other mini figs I have but they're just not as exciting as a 3ft long SSD which, disregarding the lack of detail underneath, is pretty cool. If the Ewok village is the only other large Star Wars set we'll see this year I guess it'll be a cheap year for me on the Lego front as play sets hold little interest for me. Although perhaps I'll try and seek out a few older UCS models for my collection.

pvancil27

emmtwosix said:

When I hear "Ewok Village" 10xxx-series set, I keep thinking Cloud City, only bigger, probably a lot more so. Anyone else get this feeling?

Somewhere between it and the DS. It likely wont have the wow factor the DS does but it wont be as bad buildwise as CC was

Jverweij

y2josh said:

LegoFanTexas said:

Bandit said:

I'll tell you what figs it can include. Ghost obi wan, ghost anakin, and ghost yoda. Boom. Your move TLG.
;)

Instant classic! That would indeed go over very well... :)

Sure. Until the ghost Anakin is a Hayden minifig...

that would seriously piss me off :P

jockosjungle

emmtwosix said:

When I hear "Ewok Village" 10xxx-series set, I keep thinking Cloud City, only bigger, probably a lot more so. Anyone else get this feeling?

I don't really see how it can be done well, up to UCS standard or even DS set standard. The village was on top of tall trees. so I can't see it being like it is in the film. I'm guessing just a series of huts, which is all the village ever was. Can't see it being very exciting myself, aside from C3PO on a chair, can't think of a notable scene involving it.

So i'm picturing four wooden huts connected by bridges with the tree bits missed off. Can't really see what else itcould possibly be, and it doesn't sound like the sort of thing you'd want to display next to a cool Xwing.

Now if it was the imperial base, I can see that looking a little cooler. Stick an ATAT on there, the big dish.

R

hoyatables

I'm guessing it will be a little cheaper than 10188, with four trees and related huts. What will make it "big" are the four brick built trees. I could be skewed because I am thinking of my old 1983 Kenner Ewok village

bellybutton290

^i actually think you are on the money but it will be awful imo if they do something similar. The only way to salvage it is stick imperials in it and make it a battle scene, but then they didn't battle in the village so not sure how likely that would be.

Bumblepants

We can only hope the Ewok village is full of catapults and flick-fire logs!

dougts

Cloud City done in the same style as the 10188 might be pretty cool - a fair amount of scenes could be covered as well: Carbon chamber, vader/luke final fight scene location, dining room where Han shoots at Vader, landing pads for mini MF/Slave 1, Ugnaut area where Artoo finds C3PO in bits, han's interrogation chamber

Pretty much all the main minifigures were there as well, so you can have a great supply of them, plus throw in a couple ugnauts and Lobot

rocao

streeker said:

$500 vs the $2,700 being listed in the latest Marketplace? I don't mean to offend the person selling his set, but if he offered his 10179 for $500, you bet for me that would be an ¨automatic buy.¨

I do agree people will wait for a sale or double points or another promotion. Five hundred dollars or whatever price LEGO is going to peg this imaginery rehash is still going to be a lot of money. It is for many families, mine including. But my automatic buy doesn't mean buying it on release day; it means definitely buying it when you can rustle up the cash, when there is a sale and not totally dismissing as a 'crazy price, who would pay that?' 10188 has taught me well.

$500 for 10179 and the $500 for a hypothetical re-release when that is market price are not the same thing.

I understand now when you more correctly describe it as "definite". Automatic is reflexive, involuntary, and without deliberation. So the set is released, and it is bought automatically without hesitation and consideration. Waiting for sales, allocating money, etc. are conditions that may never come to pass.

Legoboy

^^^ I don't believe it has a battle scene. I understand it doesn't include an AT-ST and is all about figs - lots of teddy bears. Full of trees and rope bridges etc.

bellybutton290

^can't wait then! (insert required level of sarcasm) I'll have 10 ewok attack sets instead please, at least they have scout troopers and speeder bikes. This could rank worse than 7879 echo base IMO, if you are correct (which I have no doubt you are). I suppose if you like the ewoks then it's a winner.