76052 - Batman Classic TV Series, Batcave

madforLEGO

KazJY said:

madforLEGO said:

KazJY said:

I get home from getting the Batcave with VIP points, and then see that Freeze is the April promo... I should have waited.

You could always return it and wait for April..  (IMO) kinda of a crappy thing to do but if you really want to get your bang for the buck with a 269.99 USD set I can see someone doing that. Not sure if you get the VIP points back though.

Yeah, my thoughts exactly.  I know what you mean.  It's not like I won't spend $75 there again, but I know this month's promo is over, and I wasn't excited about next month, so I figured "why not do it now?"  I'll get it one way or another.  :-)  

The promo will likely be online as well so if they somehow run out at the store you can always order online (unless the tax is cheaper at the store or something).

ryjay

I really want to like this set enough to buy it, but I'm not there yet. For selfish reasons I wish it was more of a display set then a play set.  I think the tipping point may come if I ever physically see it and have it in my hand....then maybe "what the heck, what's $270 when you can have this instead?!?

BTW, does/did lego ever make a large base plate in the color of the cave bricks?

Bumblepants

ryjay said:

BTW, does/did lego ever make a large base plate in the color of the cave bricks?

Indiana Jones and the last Egyptian adventures theme had some raised dark tan baseplates

madforLEGO

ryjay said:

I really want to like this set enough to buy it, but I'm not there yet. For selfish reasons I wish it was more of a display set then a play set.  I think the tipping point may come if I ever physically see it and have it in my hand....then maybe "what the heck, what's $270 when you can have this instead?!?

BTW, does/did lego ever make a large base plate in the color of the cave bricks?

How do you mean large base plate? 32x32 or 48x48?
They have the light bley 48x48, and I think the have close representation of the tan in the new 32x32 baseplate out now

monkeyhanger

Saw the Batcave in the flesh today at the Metrocentre Lego shop - it looks surprisingly big in the flesh.

It is still begging for a substantial lump of Wayne Manor to be MOC'd over the top of it all on stilts like Jabba's Palace over the Rancor Pit. If I was desperate for another Lego fix before the next decent SW UCS offering (a big pass on the recently announced Assault on Hoth) then i'd be sorely tempted for the next AFOL day if Lego will sell a hundred or so of those wallpaper bricks via pick-a-brick. The MOC would really extend the build.

madforLEGO

monkeyhanger said:

Saw the Batcave in the flesh today at the Metrocentre Lego shop - it looks surprisingly big in the flesh.

It is still begging for a substantial lump of Wayne Manor to be MOC'd over the top of it all on stilts like Jabba's Palace over the Rancor Pit. If I was desperate for another Lego fix before the next decent SW UCS offering (a big pass on the recently announced Assault on Hoth) then i'd be sorely tempted for the next AFOL day if Lego will sell a hundred or so of those wallpaper bricks via pick-a-brick. The MOC would really extend the build.

Yeah. Don't hold your breath on seeing those in a PaB wall. I'm guessing they will be pricier than a regular brick and therefore not likely found in a wall.

sklamb

It will be interesting to see if they become available from Bricks & Pieces, and, if available, at what price!

madforLEGO

sklamb said:

It will be interesting to see if they become available from Bricks & Pieces, and, if available, at what price!

Depends on if they are 'licensed' parts. If not they could be available, but likely perpetually sold out as I'm guessing many others will also want the brick as well.
As for the price, I'm guessing they will be somewhat pricey compared to standard 1x4 brick.

legomental

SumoLego said:

legomental said:

I personally think they should have scrapped the helicopter and put more parts into the actual build. It's lacking the excitement of a modular build for me.

All jokes aside, the Helicopter is an iconic part of the '60's show.  If there is one set that ought to have a helicopter and a car, it's this one.

(Where is my Batman Lighthouse and Landspeeder?)

It's a playset, not a modular, so you really can't expect that level of structural detail.  (Much like how the City fire station and police station are completely impractical as structures.) 

Just noticed that there is a Friends lighthouse and a lighthouse in the Scooby-Doo line as well.  Anyone want to take bets on whether we have a Nexo Knights rolling lighthouse next year?

I didn't explain my thoughts fully as I was on the phone which only allows limited space for some reason to comment. 

I am not saying I think the helicopter is pointless but I wonder if they could have sold it as a separate set in order to allow more to be added to the build of the main structure. I am not sure who this set is aimed at to be honest. It's very pricey and therefore not your average kids toy. It's got the nostalgia to appeal a lot to AFOLs but if that's the case then the build experience needs to be appealing like the modulars appeal (I'm not saying this should be a modular piece but it needs more 'build quality' in my opinion). There are some good suggestions above on how it could be made more of a display piece. They are, after all, all toys so all are playsets but some display better than others and even the city fire station and police stations display better than this I personally think. 

Its a shame as having heard it was coming out I got very excited but visually this just disappoints for me. Never mind the price point. I am looking forward to seeing people's mocs as hopefully these will give me better ideas!

Fauch

if they made printed bricks, and did not just apply stickers on 1x4x3 panels for example, it may mean it will appear in more sets. also they probably made it tileable for a reason.

BrickDancer

A lot of the theories about the costs or required repeat uses being drivers for printed parts, but I just don't see this being the case. CMF's all use unique & printed parts, rarely reused in regular sets. The cheap little Junior's sets have printed Spider-man or Batman pieces that you'll never see again in a system-scale Superhero set. Ssooo many little cheap Friends sets come with nice printed parts, sometimes being the first and only even.

Then you go and tell me that a $250 set aimed at the adult demographic can't afford a few extra printed parts??? Yea okay...

Lyichir

BrickDancer said:

A lot of the theories about the costs or required repeat uses being drivers for printed parts, but I just don't see this being the case. CMF's all use unique & printed parts, rarely reused in regular sets. The cheap little Junior's sets have printed Spider-man or Batman pieces that you'll never see again in a system-scale Superhero set. Ssooo many little cheap Friends sets come with nice printed parts, sometimes being the first and only even.

Then you go and tell me that a $250 set aimed at the adult demographic can't afford a few extra printed parts??? Yea okay...

There are a lot of things you're ignoring. The CMFs in particular have a very high price for their size due in no small part to the cost of those parts—and because they are so small they are produced in much larger quantities than expensive D2C sets, which also offsets those costs. Juniors sets are also produced in huge quantities and have higher costs compared to similarly-sized sets. Cheap Friends sets? Again, it's a matter of quantity. The more Lego can use a printed part, the more justifiable the cost becomes. And small sets are produced in quantities that are orders of magnitude higher than large and expensive sets.

Another factor is the difference in how many decorations a set needs. A new decoration for a small set might be the only new decoration that set needs. A sticker sheet essentially consists of one new element, so there's hardly any cost for swapping a sticker for a printed piece. For a huge set like this, every single decorated piece could be a new printed element—or a single sticker sheet. It's the difference between one new element and dozens, and the budget that ISN'T used on prints can instead be used for recolors, or for prints on parts that can't be stickered due to their shape.

Finally, a lot of parts, like fig parts, are often designed with printing in mind. But a lot of parts AREN'T—which means that the machining necessary to put them through Lego's printing machines doesn't even exist. And while printing a part that that machinery exists for is not much more expensive than a single sticker sheet or recolor, creating that machinery for a new part is significantly more expensive.

BrickDancer

^Some of your points would make sense for this Batcave, being the number of pieces that would need to be printed versus on a sticker sheet. But this set is a bit particular in that it has both printed pieces (wallpaper bricks, Helicopter canopy) and sticker sheet. 1 sticker that caught my attention right away is the 'H' for the helipad. This could have been easily printed as 2 halves of the same thing and helped all of us avoid a GIGANTIC sticker that needs care in aligning together. While the some of the other stickers are just piddly little things like the dial on the rotary phone or the various computer screens, which all easily could have been re-purposed for other sets or uses. This leaves only a few specific stickers that are difficult to reuse, such as the Wayne's portraits, 4 bat emblems, 'keep off Atomic Pile', bulletin board (arguably reuseable), and Bat-fins for the Helicopter. This is not many at all and could have been significantly reduced from what they ended up with as a sticker sheet.

So some sets require a higher number of stickers like this Batcave, the Haunted House, the Kwik-e-Mart, etc. and I can certainly understand the balance between having more or less stickers each. But how do you explain a $200 set like the UCS B-wing needing a sticker sheet for more than just the obligatory plaque sticker? They couldn't have just spent the extra $0.25 to print the damned 3 orange circles??? Or how about $400 Super Star Destroyer that needed 10 or 11 prints (all of which were 2x and only 1x2 or 2x2 tile sizes) plus the plaque? Or how about 10229 Winter Village Cottage a $100 set that had a whole 3 stickers but they somehow couldn't afford to have them printed?

In the end without actual data (number of sets/pieces/etc.) and costs (per piece, per print, per run, per set), admittedly we are both grasping at straws on either side of the argument without sufficient information to fully decide one way or the other on a wide basis. But then again, I'm not TLG management that has to make these calls on cost vs. quality. I'm just the paying audience who wishes for better and is just disappointed by the opposite response by the designers/manufacturer. Internal costs, production politics, marketing ploys aside.

CCC

Plus there is the age argument too. Younger kids sets tend to have printed rather rather stickered parts as younger kids cannot apply stickers and younger kids pull them off, put them in their mouths, put them in the bath, etc.

chrisalddin

how did this turn into a printed Vs stickers debate?

Fauch

chris : two words : brickset forum

chrisalddin

Fauch said:

chris : two words : brickset forum

point.

TheLoneTensor

chrisalddin said:

how did this turn into a printed Vs stickers debate?

Because it's a divisive argument, and will never be solved until those that actually like stickers die off from natural selection.

exciter1

SumoLego said:

legomental said:

I personally think they should have scrapped the helicopter and put more parts into the actual build. It's lacking the excitement of a modular build for me.

All jokes aside, the Helicopter is an iconic part of the '60's show.  If there is one set that ought to have a helicopter and a car, it's this one.

(Where is my Batman Lighthouse and Landspeeder?)

It's a playset, not a modular, so you really can't expect that level of structural detail.  (Much like how the City fire station and police station are completely impractical as structures.) 

Just noticed that there is a Friends lighthouse and a lighthouse in the Scooby-Doo line as well.  Anyone want to take bets on whether we have a Nexo Knights rolling lighthouse next year?

The Bat Copter is very iconic, but it was only featured in the 1966 "Batman: The Movie".  I'm glad they included it, but I didn't want anyone to be confused when they searched for the episode and didn't find it.

Sethro3

As long as the target audience is children, they will continue to have stickers since "kids like stickers." I believe that to be true, but in some of these sets that clearly aren't aimed at children, it is a bit baffling outside of production costs. Yes, in a set like this every minifigure print that is new adds a lot to the line-up, plus molded legs on multiple figures.

SumoLego

exciter1 said:

SumoLego said:

All jokes aside, the Helicopter is an iconic part of the '60's show.

The Bat Copter is very iconic, but it was only featured in the 1966 "Batman: The Movie".  I'm glad they included it, but I didn't want anyone to be confused when they searched for the episode and didn't find it.

Yes - that is factually accurate.  I normally mush together the television show with the movie.  (Similar with the movie Serenity included into the Firefly show.)

God knows they didn't have the budget for a helicopter on the '60's television show!

Same reason why there is not a single helicopter in either Ghostbusters movies.  How are we going to get a GB helicopter?

Bumblepants

^to quote the Hoth "UCS" designers: "There isn't one in the movie but we thought it would be cool"

Boom. There comes the helicopter.

bluedragon

^ you nearly made me choke on my lunch.

CCC

Sethro3 said:

As long as the target audience is children, they will continue to have stickers since "kids like stickers." I believe that to be true, but in some of these sets that clearly aren't aimed at children, it is a bit baffling outside of production costs. Yes, in a set like this every minifigure print that is new adds a lot to the line-up, plus molded legs on multiple figures.

Based on a survey of two, kids like stickers in general but not stickers on Lego. They always ask me to do their Lego stickers.

legomental

SumoLego said:

exciter1 said:

SumoLego said:

All jokes aside, the Helicopter is an iconic part of the '60's show.

The Bat Copter is very iconic, but it was only featured in the 1966 "Batman: The Movie".  I'm glad they included it, but I didn't want anyone to be confused when they searched for the episode and didn't find it.

Yes - that is factually accurate.  I normally mush together the television show with the movie.  (Similar with the movie Serenity included into the Firefly show.)

God knows they didn't have the budget for a helicopter on the '60's television show!

Same reason why there is not a single helicopter in either Ghostbusters movies.  How are we going to get a GB helicopter?

The same way we'll get a GB lighthouse probably

legomental

CCC said:

Sethro3 said:

As long as the target audience is children, they will continue to have stickers since "kids like stickers." I believe that to be true, but in some of these sets that clearly aren't aimed at children, it is a bit baffling outside of production costs. Yes, in a set like this every minifigure print that is new adds a lot to the line-up, plus molded legs on multiple figures.

Based on a survey of two, kids like stickers in general but not stickers on Lego. They always ask me to do their Lego stickers.

My kid agrees with yours

SumoLego

Bumblepants said:

^to quote the Hoth "UCS" designers: "There isn't one in the movie but we thought it would be cool"

Boom. There comes the helicopter.

UCS Hoth Lighthouse.  I just blew my own mind.  

Fauch

UCS Hoth dog stand

SumoLego

^ UCS Popsicle Stand?

scubagirl

I'm sure everyone knows already, Mr. Freeze will be available free with a $75 purchase in April 1-15  at the Lego store and Lego.com

madforLEGO

scubagirl said:

I'm sure everyone knows already, Mr. Freeze will be available free with a $75 purchase in April 1-15  at the Lego store and Lego.com

Yeah I think most are already lining up their wish lists as to what to buy to get up to the amount to get a fig.

ryjay

Ok.....so who has bought it and built it?  

ryjay

....just what I thought...no one actually bought one :)

jediami65

Went to two Lego stores today both had the set on display: it is a lot bigger than I expected.  IMO it needs at least one other wall next to study and behind the main part of the Bat-cave. Over all very impressive, just trying to decide by today/tomorrow or wait the week for 2 x VIP points.

monkeyhanger

Slightly tempted for the next AFOL day, with the free Mr Freeze fig, although with this and the Assault on Hoth having a cool reception, they could well be heavily discounted. Batcave looks quite big in the flesh (at the Lego store - about the size of 3 Mon Calamari/Home Ones)

SumoLego

I have to agree that the set is much more impressive in-person.

The Batmobile is gigantic (probably noticeably out-of-scale for modular cities) and the Batcopter may be itself enough to justify purchase of the set.

chrisalddin

can someone who has it place it side by side with a set most of us have?
hmm what is a set a lot of us have.

Ecto 1 and Wall-e next to batcave should do the trick.

donutboy

I saw this in the Lego store window this afternoon and, I must say, it looks mighty impressive in the flesh. (That can't be the right expression). The minifigures are fantastic, the batmobile and batcopter are excellent (ahh, if only they were available seperately) and the building itself is a lot larger than it seems in the pictures. 
Alas, it is way over my Lego budget, but I think anyone who takes the plunge will not be disappointed at all.

sweetness34

ryjay said:

....just what I thought...no one actually bought one :)

Waiting for double points

vwong19

Waiting for Double VIP points and ordering it online because I could use the large box for shipping stuff.

madforLEGO

Im waiting for more people to buy these and break them up so I can get the Joker, Catwoman, and the batmobile. I do not want anything else out of it.
I figure that either double points or the Mr Freeze give away is going to get more people to buy these, and hopefully those to break them up to sell.

ARo2891

madforLEGO said:

Im waiting for more people to buy these and break them up so I can get the Joker, Catwoman, and the batmobile. I do not want anything else out of it.
I figure that either double points or the Mr Freeze give away is going to get more people to buy these, and hopefully those to break them up to sell.

I have the exact same sentiment to a T.  Plus I have planned purchases in April so I can pick up the mr freeze for free.

mathew

madforLEGO said:

Im waiting for more people to buy these and break them up so I can get the Joker, Catwoman, and the batmobile. I do not want anything else out of it.
I figure that either double points or the Mr Freeze give away is going to get more people to buy these, and hopefully those to break them up to sell.

Yeah, but you're wanting exactly what everyone else wants.  Those items will cost you probably 75% of the set itself.  You could buy the set now (if you can afford it) and sell off the stuff you don't want and probably come out better off.

mathew

ryjay said:

....just what I thought...no one actually bought one :)

I get the feeling that most people come to complain and no longer buy any Lego.

chrisalddin

mathew said:

ryjay said:

....just what I thought...no one actually bought one :)

I get the feeling that most people come to complain and no longer buy any Lego.

i buy lego, just not this set.

gmonkey76

I will buy this set when there is double points, and I'm up to date on the 2014/15 UCS sets I want.

super_curry_max

so the 60s mr freeze is a legoshop promo?

SumoLego

vwong19 said:

Waiting for Double VIP points and ordering it online because I could use the large box for shipping stuff.

Not worried about minifigure-sized Otto Preminger faceprints on your Batcave box?

madforLEGO

mathew said:

madforLEGO said:

Im waiting for more people to buy these and break them up so I can get the Joker, Catwoman, and the batmobile. I do not want anything else out of it.
I figure that either double points or the Mr Freeze give away is going to get more people to buy these, and hopefully those to break them up to sell.

Yeah, but you're wanting exactly what everyone else wants.  Those items will cost you probably 75% of the set itself.  You could buy the set now (if you can afford it) and sell off the stuff you don't want and probably come out better off.

Yeah, I'm not guessing it will be cheap but seeing as the set is just being released I can afford to wait to see what everything looks like when the dust settles. If the Batmobile can be had for 75 USD and the figures I want for 15 each I'll likely just buy the stuff separately at this point. If it is much more then I could buy a set, but I'll still wait until double points and the promo for the Mr Freeze figure is over to decide (as there is always another double point event in the fall anyway, plus the pre BF event with double points and a give way set).

Plus if it is too much, I can investigate BLing the Batmobile and maybe just getting the stickers for it and maybe paying a bit for the Joker and Catwoman.

Finally, not everyone wants to a buy a set to break it up to sell parts off it off. At 269.99 USD I have a hard time justifying this purchase when I do not want most of what is in the set. But others will likely be breaking these up for parts, figures, and the vehicles and that may keep prices a bit more manageable

super_curry_max said:

so the 60s mr freeze is a legoshop promo?

Yes.

Diggydoes

Commercial break: i'm currently selling the Batmobile from the set in the marketplace ;)