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And £3.99? Even the SW ones are £2.99.
And probably not at that price. £4 to buy, so if they sell for £8 inc postage then 80p for posting, 80p for ebay, 60p for paypal. Leaves £1.80 profit. And that is before any claims about selling fakes, items not shown up, etc. I guess it depends how long it takes someone to remove the pin and whether they do a good job at it but I cannot really see that it would be worth it. If they start selling at £15, then maybe.
As for people doing it themselves, I doubt it will really be that popular. Why have a collection you know is all genuine lego, but only sort of as the minifigures are not real ones.
I can see them selling to be used as keychains and bag charms though.
I'm sure @SumoLego will be all over this!!
She's an animal suit.
She's a quirky army builder.
The head gear is great for making other insects.
The Keychain will have that same wing piece and it won't have any damage from the keychain, so the market will be replenished although still fairly expensive per piece. This could bring the price of the actual minifigure down.
I would also like to play devils advocate and say that owning the keychain version of a minifigure is just a different version of collecting. It is Lego and it's a complete version of that minifigure, it just happens to have damage. Since collecting is not a black and white hobby, I see plenty of people being satisfied with owning the keychain and will stop seeking out the original.
Yes, each to their own when it comes to collecting (whether filling gaps with broken keychains or fakes). No doubt some people will be happy with a glued minifig with a hole in its head, just as some are happy with a fake. This might decrease the demand a little. But considering supply is already low, again I doubt it will impact on the real figure / set price.
As mentioned, some chose to collect the key chain version if indeed the non key chain one is too expensive, and I don't see anything wrong with that. There's no point in downplaying it, key chain or no key chain, just be glad that no fake is involved at all :)
They won't be worth that though, as there is now a cheap source of them. Also is there any real demand for them? You could say 100% of them listed at BL have sold, or alternatively that the six month demand is one.
As I noted above, there is probably no difference to the figure price. It is rare to part the figure out, so the availability of cheap wings does nothing to the figure price if the rest of the figure is not available.
People don't find a bee and think they'll make money selling the parts. They sell the figure.
"If someone wants a cheap keychain version instead of the real thing, then they might as well buy the chinese knock-off"
"people who take the bumblebee figure off the keychain to say they have a complete collection are no closer to a complete collection than if someone were to buy a fake"
snobby elitist crap.
I think the price of the original CMF Bumblebee Girl will drop a little as a result of the keyring as some people who want the figure will be happy with the keyring version at a fraction of the price but as there will always be people who will be willing to pay the premium I doubt it will drop by much. One of the biggest factors to consider, IMO, is the lack of the honeypot with the keyring version.
So sure that wings will probably drop as soon as a few people partout the key ring but I think the complete CMF will stay solid.
The availability of the whole minifig doesn't change either - the one from the keychain is effectively not the same because, again, it is glued, and it also has a hole in the head.
I do think some people will grab a keychain and remove the chain instead of getting a CMF. Not sure if enough people would do that to make a huge difference in the price of the CMF.
I doubt there will be many people that value the CMF as a collection that will use a keychain one, just as they won't use a fake one. Why? Because they'll know they have cheated / skimped to complete their collection. Their valued collection has less value because of it. There will be others that will be happy with a broken keychain version, but I doubt those people would have ever bought the real thing. Thus the price is not likely to change. Someone buying a broken keychain has as much effect on the secondary market price as someone buying a fake. Next to none, as they were never in the market for one.
Whether people believe something is real or not affects the price, in answer to your first sentence.
Looks like I will have to check the values of my other CMF's and trade a few of the valuable ones for another bumble bee or two. It would be wonderful if they would produce equal values of every fig in the case so this problem would not arise with the rarer ones; but then the ones that more folks covet would cost a fortune. Or just make the darn bags transparent so no one will buy the ones they don't want. I am tired of this game of trying to find the ones I want, which usually are the rarer figs. Nuff said...
I'd rather talk about the original issue, thank you very much.
Really? To me, and to a hell of a lot of others, one is a Lego Bumblebee Girl, the other is a Lego Bumblebee Girl.
You're the one calling it the equivalent of a fake And what percentage of Lego buyers is that? A tiny minority. This doesn't even apply to all Afols nevermind kids.
Yeah, these are the people you said might as well buy a fake instead. I describe myself as an Afol. Adult FAN of Lego - not adult collector of Lego. But according to you I might as well buy fakes? Like I said before, snobbery.
Wrong. I have bought many items on the secondary market, including CMFs (series 1 crash test dummy for example). But I never bought the series one Magician, even though I missed him at the time. I was planning to but then I realised I didn't need to. I made my own. The body from the bride & groom set is the same, got a wand from a friends set, a top hat and a random spare head came from the build a minifig section in a Lego shop. I was in the market for one but now I'm not. Because I have a magician.
I agree. But that is up to the individual. You don't get to decide for them.
P.S. Genuine thanks for giving me the opportunity to finally figure out how to do quotes. I've never bothered to work it out before.
It's not fake Lego pieces, bit that is the very definition of a custom. If you tried to sell or trade that to me without identifying it as a custom, we would have a problem.
The Bee Girl keychain is not a CMF.
And we are only referencing people that specifically collect genuine CMFs. It's silly to cite Lego civilians who have no idea what a collector may pay on the secondary market.
If you were to identify your Magician as a CMF, that would be disengenuous. That's the point.
There's a MOC/Bricklinked Cafe Corner on eBay that doesn't command even half of the value of a used original Cafe Corner. If I were to pay market value for an item an discover it is not as it appears, that-s clearly wrong.
The introduction of the keychain will not allow the completion of a completionists collection of cmfs. However it "may" satisfy the casual persons desires to "own" the bumblebee minifigure. This would remove that person from the market for a undamaged cmf version with the honey pot.
I agree with the argument of the value of the wings being irrevalent to the value of the original. so at this point I don't think the value of the original will decrease just the volume of sales will decrease by the number of people no longer in the market for the bumblebee. Fans will always want the original and the original hasn't been rereleased so it supply has not been increased. This means status quo unless a glut of sellers come in and need to sell quickly to a slightly smaller demand.
I've only used Keychain figs to suppliment my minifigure collection once and that was for the ninja turtles. I bought the four turtle keychains because it was easier and cheaper at the time than sourcing the original figures. Im the first to point out they have holes in their heads and would never claim they are anything other than the Keychain parts. But for my MOCs they look just fine to me and I'm not in the market to replace them as I don't care about them enough to warrant anything more than the genuine lego Keychain versions.
Last point. I would never own or purchase a fake/knockoff minifigure that was made and sold by another company.
When the cheerleader and skater were rereleased in the calendar set, they affected the price of the original a little as they were the same as the original. They weren't much cheaper than the secondary market price though, so the effect was quite small, although when they went on sale there were lots available. Fortunately for sellers this coincided with lots of new collectors so they were still easy to get rid of.
The only way I see the price of the genuine CMF bumble bee changing is if someone is able to steal large quantities of parts before they are assembled, or at least the headgear.
The good news is that it seems at least Lego has the molds and will hopefully reuse that headgear again. Unless of course they made large quantities of them before deciding it was going to be a rare figure so had loads left and need to do something with them.
The mistake was to call a keychain a fake. The word's too emotive. It's a genuine LEGO keychain. It's only a fake if somebody calls it a minifig, CMF or not. A keychain has passed that stage in it's life and can never go back. It has been terminally modified. Furthermore, it's not a minifig because minifigs can be taken apart, and a keychain cannot. And if, as is usually the case, it's not actually glued but effectively welded together, that is an absolute - it cannot ever be returned to being a minifig. That does not necessarily exclude being able to recover some parts, like the bumblebee wings, if they're only held on by the head.
There's a further issue with keychains. For a while at least, keychains weren't made from the same parts as minifigs. For example, some arms were embosssed on the inside. That probably depends on the figure in question. However it has to be a general rule that, when trying to assemble any set, it may well be possible for someone to subsequently prove that it is not original based on some tiny difference in the parts used - and once the information is known, anyone can do it.
People can collect whatever they wish, but it is wrong to call them something which they are not.
Agreed. I never said it was. I said it is a Lego Magician. My point is that this, to me, doesn't make it any less of a Lego Magician than a CMF Lego Magician. Just as the Keyring Bee Girl is not any less "Lego" than a CMF Bee Girl. But others have derisively stated that it would be no better than a fake.
Agreed, but there's no chance I would ever do that because I realise that people's definition and value of Lego sometimes differ from my own.
Again I agree. Never said it was. But both ARE Lego Bee Girls.
No. This quote "If someone wants a cheap keychain version instead of the real thing, then they might as well buy the chinese knock-off version" does not reference anyone in particular, rather it includes everyone who might consider buying a keyring in it's statement.
The CMF collector? Might as well buy a fake.
An AFOL who wants a Lego Bumblebee Girl? Might as well buy a fake.
The parent whose child wants a Bumblebee Girl? Might as well buy a fake.
It's not my point. My point is that I have a Lego Magician and for someone to dismiss that as no better than a fake smacks of snobbery.
Agreed. But if you were to buy the MOC/Bricklinked item on the understanding that it wasn't an original, for a fair price and then someone says that your Lego item is no better than a fake... I think that shows an arrogance that reflects badly on them.
The "fake" comment was directed at your keyring - which isn't a minifig but a keyring. Butchering a keyring does not give you a minifig, in the same way that modifying anything else produced by TLG does not give you a LEGO part.
It's not arrogance. Pedantry, maybe.
The general consensus seems to be that, unless the wings can be salvaged, it is a different beast, albeit one that some may find aesthetically pleasing or even avidly seek.
I think we all agree that the value of the CMF Bumblebee Girl could fall, but only very slightly and probably not at all, as a result of the Keyring being released.
Goodwill and seasons greetings to all fellow members of this forum, especially the ones who have engaged with me in this thread.
However, it's more likely that it was recognised as being popular and the sort of thing that virtually anyone would appreciate.
Apparently, (some) (new) keychains are completely different from normal minifigs, and made from different parts.
The torso doesn't have a neck but has a hole instead. The legs have a post that goes up through the torso, forming the neck, and goes into the head. The metal keychain itself goes through the top of the head into this post. I don't know whether the head is the same or not, although it still has a hole in the top.
This means several things. Firstly it means that they do not have to be glued or welded, which is presumably the main reason for doing it. Secondly, the legs and torso, and possibly the head, are not interchangeable with those of a standard minifig, which might resolve some licensing issues. It also means that buying a keychain and "converting" it is a lot more obvious, and that including one in a collection of supposed minifigs is even more dubious than before.
And wandering past a brand store earlier, on a brief and hurried examination of a random keychain, it didn't appear to be a minifig at all.