LEGO fight Against Chinese counterfeit LEGO

Baby_Yoda

Speaking of copying... :)

Bumblepants

Baby_Yoda said:

Speaking of copying... :)

Always two comments there are

daewoo

Which Lego set are they ripping off?  TLG most certainly wouldn't make a set like that and Lego doesn't own exclusive rights to make interlocking plastic building blocks.

Gibbo1959

Don't think anyone said they were ripping off any sets - it's just a blatant, unoriginal copy of Lego product - the 2x1 'brick wall' brick, the 16 x 8 stud baseplate, the minifigure style character for Trump, the Mexican CMF character on the box, even the type of font used for their logo in a box - and not a particularly clever use of any of it. So lacking originality on pretty much every level. But that's just my opinion! 

Lyichir

Gotta say, even though I dislike Lego knockoffs in general, I can't think of any that filled me with such a sense of utter revulsion before. Hoping Lego fully explores the possibility of legal action against the makers of this racist crap.

pharmjod

Update from the site:

NOTE: Due to the overwhelming response for our one-of-a-kind MAGA “Build the Wall” construction set, we have temporarily sold out of our entire inventory! But don’t despair! Place your pre-order now because we have a massive shipment coming to us from the manufacturer which will arrive in our warehouseon Dec. 9 and we are increasing our staff to ensure that your order ships immediately! Thank you for your support of our conservative company and the American economy!

Not gonna lie, the irony that this set is (I am fairly certain) being produced in China coupled with the last line is pretty hilarious to me. 

And LEGO isn't likely to have any legit grounds to go after this particular type of product. It would be a total waste of time and money for no useful end to them. 

CCC

daewoo said:

Which Lego set are they ripping off?  TLG most certainly wouldn't make a set like that and Lego doesn't own exclusive rights to make interlocking plastic building blocks.

A wall to keep out invading hordes ...

datsunrobbie

daewoo said:

Which Lego set are they ripping off?  TLG most certainly wouldn't make a set like that and Lego doesn't own exclusive rights to make interlocking plastic building blocks.

LEGO has a valid trademark for the minifigure, so they should be able to use that if they are interested in shutting this down.

Lyichir

pharmjod said:

Update from the site:

NOTE: Due to the overwhelming response for our one-of-a-kind MAGA “Build the Wall” construction set, we have temporarily sold out of our entire inventory! But don’t despair! Place your pre-order now because we have a massive shipment coming to us from the manufacturer which will arrive in our warehouseon Dec. 9 and we are increasing our staff to ensure that your order ships immediately! Thank you for your support of our conservative company and the American economy!

Not gonna lie, the irony that this set is (I am fairly certain) being produced in China coupled with the last line is pretty hilarious to me. 

And LEGO isn't likely to have any legit grounds to go after this particular type of product. It would be a total waste of time and money for no useful end to them. 

I would think the useful end for Lego would be removing an infringing product that is so offensive that any brand confusion generated could have a significant impact on Lego's reputation.

You're probably right that it would most likely not reap a large financial reward, and Lego might even have trouble winning such a case if the manufacturers passed it off as some sick parody. Call it wishful thinking on my part that these racist jerks would pay the price for appropriating a brand image I love dearly.

pharmjod

If you really care, you won't want LEGO to say a word. That would being a ton of attention to what is otherwise an obscure knock off. It's better to just ignore it. I find life is much more enjoyable when I don't get offended by stupid stuff people do.

Aanchir

If the logo colors were the same as the actual LEGO logo colors (as in the Lepin logo) they could maybe make an argument that it’s being deceptively marketed. With the blue field and red outlines there’s probably plausible deniability though.

If enough people do in fact start misreporting or misidentifying it as a LEGO product, I would at least expect LEGO to prepare a response to press inquiries clarifying that the company has no connection to this product and that it does not reflect their values, and possibly issue a C&D notice if they see it being sold online in any way that they consider deceptive. But I sort of doubt it’d escalate to a lawsuit.

DadsAFOL

pharmjod said:

If you really care, you won't want LEGO to say a word. That would being a ton of attention to what is otherwise an obscure knock off. It's better to just ignore it. I find life is much more enjoyable when I don't get offended by stupid stuff people do.

I saw it on the news in LA last night, so definitely not obscure.    Although LA isn’t exactly core MAGA demographics....

pharmjod

It's a curiosity. It's "newsworthy" then forgotten about. Nothing worth getting worked up about at all. Companies like that have a target demographic and much of what they do is designed to "offend" those that are easily offended. They would LOVE for detractors to make a big deal about it and cry foul. It's free advertising for them and they get the pleasure of living in your head rent free. Best to just ignore it and move on.

blokey9

i clearly misinterpreted the intention of this set. i thought it was a satirical set, because the box art shows Mexico to be this vibrant, happy and historical place. 

CCC

If lawyers are involved, then the decision about whether it infringes LEGO's IP wouldn't be made until well after Trump is no longer president anyway.

SumoLego

CCC said:

If lawyers are involved, then the decision about whether it infringes LEGO's IP wouldn't be made until well after Trump is no longer president anyway.

Hacky Stand-Up Guy says:

Do you mean by Tuesday?  Lawyers definitely don't move that fast.

daewoo

I struggle with how a wall is offensive.  Is the Great Wall of China offensive?  It was built to keep the Mongols out after all.  How about Hadrian's Wall?  That offensive?  The Amorite Wall?  

Maybe this is off topic but countries have boundaries and it is perfectly within their rights to secure them by whatever means they choose.  That someone could get offended by that speaks more to me about them than the actual barrier. 

SumoLego

daewoo said:

I struggle with how a wall is offensive.  Is the Great Wall of China offensive?

Yes, I'm sure the Mongols being excluded from Greater China probably hurt their feelings.  If we all just held hands, we wouldn't need walls.

As with everything, it's how you go about doing things - and what it symbolizes.  And with this silly set, it's not about the wall - it's about making a buck off of aggressive comments by a newsworthy source.

SumoLego

daewoo said:
Maybe this is off topic but countries have boundaries and it is perfectly within their rights to secure them by whatever means they choose.  That someone could get offended by that speaks more to me about them than the actual barrier. 

This'll be a whole different ball of yarn.  I don't think anyone objects to borders, or security, but there are all sorts of political positions that can be taken on that topic and immigration policy.  None of which can be settled in a LEGO forum...

I would skip a few steps and annex all of North and Central America north of the Panama Canal.  Some good ol'Amurican bureaucracy and taxation would make it uniformly unpleasant for everyone.  And there wouldn't be a need for a wall.  Just a couple of agents on a few bridges and a really, really big Navy!

SumoLego

I should note that I'm content that there is a little bit of precedent for Chinese authorities acknowledging that IP exists and that they opted to police the misappropriation of the IP.

I can only imagine how much payola was spent by TLG in addition to reminding the Chinese Government that they built a gigantic factory on the mainland.  

CCC

daewoo said:

I struggle with how a wall is offensive.  Is the Great Wall of China offensive?  It was built to keep the Mongols out after all.  How about Hadrian's Wall?  That offensive?  The Amorite Wall?  

Maybe this is off topic but countries have boundaries and it is perfectly within their rights to secure them by whatever means they choose.  That someone could get offended by that speaks more to me about them than the actual barrier. 

Personally, I'm not offended by it. Whether it is an adult plaything for Trump supporters, of an adult plaything mocking Trump and his views, either way it is a joke.

However, I can understand why the advertising of it is a bit more offensive. For example, they advertise it as 5+ and "This toy makes a great Christmas gift for your kids and grandkids!" Here they are mixing politics with kids toys, so I can understand why some are offended. Alhough the simple answer is not to buy it for your kids if you are offended.

But of course, it gets them great advertisments, as they are all over the news just before Xmas present buying season, and loads of people will visit their website due to the news articles around it.

Bumblepants

What an unfun Christmas morning stacking off brand 1*2s in a line would be. Anyone buying that for a kid is buying extreme disappointment. 

Aanchir

With regard to why this is more offensive than the Great Wall of China, for starters there’s the obvious difference between keeping out foreign military raids and keeping out already declining numbers of immigrants who evidence has shown boost the economy, pay taxes, create jobs, and are less violent on average than native-born citizens despite stereotypes to the contrary: https://www.adl.org/resources/fact-sheets/myths-and-facts-about-immigrants-and-immigration

But just as important is the reason that classic castle sets are OK but modern military sets are not: nobody alive today has lost parents, friends, or siblings in living memory directly because of the foreign policy decisions of the imperial dynasties that created the Great Wall of China, but that can’t be said about most 20th or 21st century governments, let alone current ones.

I’m not sure why it’s so hard for so many people to understand why modern military conflicts OR modern political disagreements are likely to be a sore spot for more people than ones that happened hundreds or even thousands of years ago. It’s not hypocrisy, it’s just trying not to be needlessly insensitive.

SumoLego

Well, I think people can be all sorts of sensitive about events that happened decades, centuries and millennia ago.

And we a dealing with a risk-averse toy company that makes plastic bricks.  (Who was once subject to criticism for co-marketing with a petroleum company.)

CCC

Aanchir said:

But just as important is the reason that classic castle sets are OK but modern military sets are not: nobody alive today has lost parents, friends, or siblings in living memory directly because of the foreign policy decisions of the imperial dynasties that created the Great Wall of China, but that can’t be said about most 20th or 21st century governments, let alone current ones.

Bring on the Roman invasion of Judea set. Jesus optional.

pharmjod

Aanchir said: 

I’m not sure why it’s so hard for so many people to understand why modern military conflicts OR modern political disagreements are likely to be a sore spot for more people than ones that happened hundreds or even thousands of years ago. It’s not hypocrisy, it’s just trying not to be needlessly insensitive.

That would be fine if someone was getting offended at LEGO for making such sets. This is a company that is pretty obviously not LEGO making a gag set. Is it in poor taste? Debatable, but for many it is. For others it's hysterical. For most, it's nothing of note whatsoever. If you want to know why Donald Trump got elected and will be again if you're not careful, keep getting offended by pointless things and sharing it online. For the record, I did not vote for Trump, lest you think I'm an apologist for him.

EvilTwin

Interesting article about IP infringement. Mentions Lepin alongside "Plada" and "Loius Vuitton":
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46224431

gantarat

Lego opening first store in Thailand

https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/news/1584910/lego-opening-first-store-in-thailand

“Asia still has a low base for Lego toys compared to many established markets in the West, but the company is also seeing an opportunity to boost its sales by five or six times in the region,

Asia have a base problem is the prices.

AustinPowers

...Puts the popcorn away momentarily...

That Trump "set" really had me in stitches for a moment, the reactions to it by some commenters as well.

I mean, shopping link or not, this is blatant satire, isn't it? No one in her/his right mind (at least outside the US) is taking Trump seriously, so why should the makers of this "set"?

On a completely unrelated note, I recently made another purchase on Aliexpress. Just couldn't resist. They have a "CMF" version of Bob Ross, complete with brush and palette. Plus there was an additional Deadpool head in the bag. At first I thought it was a mistake. I mean what has Deadpool to do with Bob Ross? Then I did a quick Google search and found out about that hysterical Deadpool 2 trailer. The makers of this "CMF" appear to have seen it to and included that head to swap out. How cool is that? Don't know who makes the fig though. Kohl probably. In any case, at 0.75 Euro including free shipping from China to Germany, I simply don't care. German customs didn't either ;-)

CCC

AustinPowers said:

I mean, shopping link or not, this is blatant satire, isn't it? No one in her/his right mind (at least outside the US) is taking Trump seriously, so why should the makers of this "set"?

I think the makers are being serious, aren't they. They sell a lot of stuff about the America First  movement.

daewoo

There is nothing wrong with Americans wanting their government to put their interests above those of foreigners.  There is nothing racist about building a wall, or a fence, or any other type of barrier.  ALL countries have a right to determine who they allow to migrate there, and who does not get to migrate there.  Cries of racism are emotional responses to perceived insult and are not based on any reality that can be proven with cold, hard, facts.  Whether the wall building set is satirical or not is not known to me, nor do I really care either way.  What it isn't is IP theft or trademark infringement or copyright infringement.  Lego does not have exclusive rights to plastic interlocking building blocks and Lego does not have a set that even comes close to resembling the one brought up.  As such, there can be no legitimate claims of counterfeiting and its inclusion in this thread is questionable at best.

BOBJACK_JACKBOB

^

datsunrobbie said:

LEGO has a valid trademark for the minifigure, so they should be able to use that if they are interested in shutting this down.

CCC

daewoo said:

As such, there can be no legitimate claims of counterfeiting and its inclusion in this thread is questionable at best.

They are infringing on the minifigure design, so I don't see why it is questionable to be here.

LEGO are taking action against another company, Zuru, who apparently supply Walmart: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-13/lego-seeks-to-halt-walmart-holiday-sales-of-competing-figurines

In this case the figures are completely different to LEGO's design so I don't really see what case they have. I hope they lose that one!

BOBJACK_JACKBOB

I've decided to take the plunge and get a 'MAGA Build The Wall' set. How do I go about invoicing a fellow Brickset member for it? (I've already checked, there's quite a few members from Mexico on here)

Aanchir

daewoo said:

There is nothing wrong with Americans wanting their government to put their interests above those of foreigners.  There is nothing racist about building a wall, or a fence, or any other type of barrier.  ALL countries have a right to determine who they allow to migrate there, and who does not get to migrate there.  Cries of racism are emotional responses to perceived insult and are not based on any reality that can be proven with cold, hard, facts.

It's wrong when the rhetoric about the supposed threats posed by foreigners in order to justify insane, unnecessary border defense spending are based in lies and stereotypes rather than actual facts about the impact immigrants (documented and undocumented alike) have on American society.

It's wrong when kids in elementary schools are telling their Hispanic classmates, regardless of national origin or citizenship status, that Trump is going to have them deported.

It's wrong when a wall along the United States border is a largely symbolic measure that will have no impact on the actual source of most "illegal immigrants" in the United States (people legally entering the country on a tourist, student, or work visa and staying after its subsequent expiration), nor be at all reliable at stopping border crossings without continuing the present spending on border patrols more or less indefinitely.

It's wrong when the "foreigners" we supposedly need to keep out include people who have already lived here their entire lives, or lived here longer than many of us here on Brickset have been alive.

It's wrong when the government is simultaneously taking steps to revoke the citizenship of people who supposedly were granted it "incorrectly", and overturn 150-year-old legal precedent on birthright citizenship.

Like, sorry if this is overly political (although I'm not the one who brought it up), but the idea that today's anti-immigrant sentiment is any less dubious than the kind that motivated stuff like the Chinese exclusion acts in previous centuries doesn't really hold up to scrutiny. Particularly when you look at the more specific justifications of such sentiment among our current leaders, as well as what forms of anti-immigrant sentiment among the general populace motivate support for those leaders. There's simply no credible argument the support for these kinds of policies is any less emotionally driven than the opposition.

gratefulnat

BOBJACK_JACKBOB said:

I've decided to take the plunge and get a 'MAGA Build The Wall' set. How do I go about invoicing a fellow Brickset member for it? (I've already checked, there's quite a few members from Mexico on here)

Now that had me laughing out loud.

Well played Sir!

Aanchir said:

Like, sorry if this is overly political (although I'm not the one who brought it up),

I can't stand Trump, nor the government's border policy, but hey, if you want to rant then stand up for it without pandering to 'I didn't start the argument - someone else did'... Way too much of this in our world today.

We can be respectful and considerate, speak our minds, and be of different opinions, all at the same time without having to make excuses or place blame on others.

daewoo

Aanchir, if you want to spout the liberal line, please feel free.  I reject it 100% for it is, identity politics based on lies and omissions.  You believe things to be wrong, that's your issue, not mine.

datsunrobbie

CCC said:

daewoo said:

As such, there can be no legitimate claims of counterfeiting and its inclusion in this thread is questionable at best.

They are infringing on the minifigure design, so I don't see why it is questionable to be here.

LEGO are taking action against another company, Zuru, who apparently supply Walmart: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-13/lego-seeks-to-halt-walmart-holiday-sales-of-competing-figurines

In this case the figures are completely different to LEGO's design so I don't really see what case they have. I hope they lose that one!

Kre-O would have a much better case for infringement on the Zuru figures than LEGO. Hasbro quit selling the Kre-O line (made by Oxford), so Oxford may have licensed their designs to Zuru.

pxchris

I come to Brickset to avoid politics and play with plastic toys.

jnscoelho

History books should come with plastic toys, apparently. But I guess in the US they probably also have "alternative history" books. 

daewoo

jnscoelho said:

History books should come with plastic toys, apparently. But I guess in the US they probably also have "alternative history" books. 

Unfortunately we do.  I can't count the times I've had to correct omissions and flat out falsehoods found in my kids' history textbooks that they were issued in school. 

As for the wall set, having relooked at it, Lego could go after them for the minifig if they wanted to.

BOBJACK_JACKBOB

AustinPowers said:

That Trump "set" really had me in stitches for a moment, the reactions to it by some commenters as well.

I mean, shopping link or not, this is blatant satire, isn't it? No one in her/his right mind (at least outside the US) is taking Trump seriously, so why should the makers of this "set"?

Despite the 'taking a dump' face, the jovial depiction of Mexico, the fact that the 'northern' side of the wall is backed by red, the missing letter (Choking Hazar), the nine bricks the wrong way round, the lack of basic bricklaying fundamentals (start at the bottom and work up, not in the middle and out at each end) and the blatant lie in the text on the box (101 pieces? Count 'em) - I don't believe anything about this set is satirical.

If it was there's no way they would go for a hat and pass up the opportunity of the hairpiece.

SumoLego

pxchris said:

I come to Brickset to avoid politics and play with plastic toys.

And to complain about them.  We like to complain.

Baby_Yoda

There is no way that set is anything but satire. I've never met a non-American, online or otherwise, who thinks of Trump as anything but a joke. That's not to say his beliefs are unpopular; as a matter of fact, the left in the US tend to be ridiculed far more than the right due to their unfortunate representation by groups such as Antifa. However, Trump's international identity, from his distinct appearance to his infamous Twitter account, makes him more myth than man.

As for The Wall (TM), please, don't bother. When a liberal and a conservative debate online, it is rarely about the same thing. @daewoo is arguing that a wall's construction is within a country's legal and ethical rights, which has nothing to do with the toy depicted. @Aanchir is making a few mostly correct statements, but only two have any relevance to the wall, and none actually refute the original comment. I doubt the current political climate will have much influence over any potential court battle between LEGO and MAGA.

SumoLego

Baby_Yoda said:

...When a liberal and a conservative debate online...

...And this is why I shut off CNN or Fox News and browse a website about LEGO.  

Maybe we can start a Brexit thread and see how quickly I can take a nap.  Or maybe a Trump Brexit thread, and then break the internet on two continents.

Muftak1

SumoLego said:

Baby_Yoda said:

...When a liberal and a conservative debate online...

...And this is why I shut off CNN or Fox News and browse a website about LEGO.  

Maybe we can start a Brexit thread and see how quickly I can take a nap.  Or maybe a Trump Brexit thread, and then break the internet on two continents.

A Trexit thread?

Baby_Yoda

SumoLego said:

Baby_Yoda said:

...When a liberal and a conservative debate online...

...And this is why I shut off CNN or Fox News and browse a website about LEGO.  

Maybe we can start a Brexit thread and see how quickly I can take a nap.  Or maybe a Trump Brexit thread, and then break the internet on two continents.

Bring up pineapple on pizza and you'll polarise Australia too.

SprinkleOtter

Baby_Yoda said:

SumoLego said:

Baby_Yoda said:

...When a liberal and a conservative debate online...

...And this is why I shut off CNN or Fox News and browse a website about LEGO.  

Maybe we can start a Brexit thread and see how quickly I can take a nap.  Or maybe a Trump Brexit thread, and then break the internet on two continents.

Bring up pineapple on pizza and you'll polarise Australia too.

... And I still don't like poutine...

And now even Canada's up in arms ;)

gmonkey76

Baby_Yoda said:

Bring up pineapple on pizza and you'll polarise Australia too.

Putting pineapple on a pizza can get you killed here. Don't even think of putting ketchup on a hot dog either. Hell come to Chicago for the food, stay because you got murdered.

Maybe we should go back to if Market Street is a Modular debate. At least that was more civilized.

CCC

Baby_Yoda said:

There is no way that set is anything but satire. I've never met a non-American, online or otherwise, who thinks of Trump as anything but a joke. That's not to say his beliefs are unpopular; as a matter of fact, the left in the US tend to be ridiculed far more than the right due to their unfortunate representation by groups such as Antifa. However, Trump's international identity, from his distinct appearance to his infamous Twitter account, makes him more myth than man.

As for The Wall (TM), please, don't bother. When a liberal and a conservative debate online, it is rarely about the same thing. @daewoo is arguing that a wall's construction is within a country's legal and ethical rights, which has nothing to do with the toy depicted. @Aanchir is making a few mostly correct statements, but only two have any relevance to the wall, and none actually refute the original comment. I doubt the current political climate will have much influence over any potential court battle between LEGO and MAGA.

I don't think Trump is a joke. He is an incredibly shrewd man that knows what people want and how to use that to his advantage.