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LEGO fight Against Chinese counterfeit LEGO

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  • FizyxFizyx Member Posts: 1,332
    I'm not sure how much the TRU situation really effected LEGO last year, since it's not like TRU suddenly deteriorated just in the last year or two (although I'm sure the lower than expected holiday sales there did have at least some effect), but has been in that position for quite awhile.  Of course, if the TRU situation ends up expanding partnerships or opportunities for smaller retailers, I think it can only be good for both LEGO and LEGO fans in the long run, so hopefully some good comes out of it.  Of course, TRU going under will almost certainly have a major effect THIS year, but hopefully it's not too bad, since I'm sure most of the toy slack will be picked up by Walmart, Target, and Amazon. (as @SumoLego pointed out while I was going back and forth between writing this and doing the work I'm supposed to be doing <.< )

    I think a bigger player was the known issues with Nexo Knights not taking off as they expected as it entered its second year, and the bloat, and ensuing drag on sales and production, of the TLBM line.  There was certainly other stuff too, like a possible under-performance of the Super Heroes Girls line, but stuff like the better than expected performance of the TLNM line likely balanced that out.  On the positive side, they ARE being more aggressive with their reactions to some of these things, cutting off sets (AoH) and whole themes (Nexo Knights) earlier than planned when they are seriously under performing, so I don't think these issues are something that will become endemic, but we'll see soon enough I guess.
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    Almost exactly a year ago ...

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/03/09/lego-reports-highest-revenue-85-year-history/

    Lego has reported the highest revenues in its 85-year history even as profits returned to a more “sustainable” level after years of double-digit growth.

    Sales in 2016 rose 6pc on the previous year to hit a new high of 37.9bn Danish kroner (£4.4bn), although in the previous year they had shot up 25pc. The brick toy company's profit rose 1.7pc to 12.2bn kroner last year.

    Bali Padda, the first non-Dane to be in charge of the company, said he was satisfied with the toy maker's performance during 2016, despite slowing growth in the second half.


    2015 had 25% growth in sales and 2016 6% on top of that. It is hardly surprising that they have not been able to retain growth and in fact shrunk back slightly.

    Just think, they could have had "satisfactory" growth of 6% in 2015, 2016 and 2017 and actually be in a worse off position than now and nobody would be talking about it as LEGO would have continued to grow their sales every year.

    Fizyx
  • jnscoelhojnscoelho Member Posts: 696
    One can work the numbers as one sees fit:
    2015->2016 = growth decreased by 19%
    2016->2017 = growth decreased by 13%

    This is a non-significant analysis, of course, but my common sense tells me that a 25% growth is not sustainable. This may just be course correction (I'd have to look at stats previous to 2015).
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    I think these are correct, at least in terms of revenue:

    15% 2014
    11% 2013
    25% 2012
    17% 2011
    37% 2010
    22% 2009

    It was double digits for about a decade before 2016.

  • daewoodaewoo Member Posts: 795
    SumoLego said:
    daewoo said:
    Hopefully TLG can develop some new partnerships to replace that one.
    Anybody want to bet LEGO increased their Amazon marketing budget?  (And how full are the shelves going to be at Wal-Mart and Target in November 2018...)


    I don't know that looking forward to it is the right way to say it, but I am extremely interested to see how this Christmas season is going to play out with TRU gone from the marketplace.  Walmart (at least around me) is extremely hit or miss.  Target does a better job of maintaining stock.  Neither excel at marketing toys. 

    I'm curious what the approach will be for Lego with the TRU exclusives.  Do they go it alone and simply only have them at their stores and Shop at Home or do they seek a deal with a retailer similar to what they had with TRU.  Time will tell.

  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    Given you can just buy stuff on-line, I'm not sure why it matters who has what in stock locally.  Especially with all the complaints about people getting sets missing stuff because someone has returned products with missing pieces.

    All I can guess is people like the cheaper than Lego store prices that they can get elsewhere.  If true, then it's really just a matter of price preference, than product availability.
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    alaskaguy said:
    Given you can just buy stuff on-line, I'm not sure why it matters who has what in stock locally. 
    Impulse buys such as a kid wanting to spend birthday money, or needing to buy a birthday present.
    Fizyx
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    CCC said:
    Impulse buys such as a kid wanting to spend birthday money, or needing to buy a birthday present.
    Anything that clamps down on impulse buying is a plus in my book - esp. amongst child consumers.
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    Tell that to a kid that wants to spend their money, once they have decided what they want they need to wait a further X days for whatever it is to be delivered. And that is after Y hours of internet or other research before being allowed to purchase it.

    Obviously wait times are not that long if you order on amazon or nationally, but having to wait once ordered can kill the enjoyment for a kid.
    datsunrobbiestluxdmcc0Muftak1gmonkey76MaffyDMr_CrossSprinkleOtter
  • daewoodaewoo Member Posts: 795
    People getting gifts last minute will always need a brick and mortar store - up until we perfect teleportation.
  • benbacardibenbacardi Member Posts: 712
    daewoo said:
    People getting gifts last minute will always need a brick and mortar store - up until we perfect teleportation.
    Where are you going to teleport to buy a gift without a brick and mortar store?
    MAGNINOMINISUMBRA
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    benbacardi said: by
    daewoo said:
    People getting gifts last minute will always need a brick and mortar store - up until we perfect teleportation.
    Where are you going to teleport to buy a gift without a brick and mortar store?
    Teleport the gift from Amazon warehouse or similar.

    While fanciful, an alternative might be closer than it sounds. Download plans and 3D print it.
  • Switchfoot55Switchfoot55 Member Posts: 3,279
    CCC said:
    Teleport the gift from Amazon warehouse or similar.

    While fanciful, an alternative might be closer than it sounds. Download plans and 3D print it.
    I'll wait for my At-Home-Lego-Extruder
    pharmjodgmonkey76MaffyD
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    edited March 2018
    CCC said:
    Tell that to a kid that wants to spend their money, once they have decided what they want they need to wait a further X days for whatever it is to be delivered. And that is after Y hours of internet or other research before being allowed to purchase it.

    Obviously wait times are not that long if you order on amazon or nationally, but having to wait once ordered can kill the enjoyment for a kid.
    I'd tell kid "boo hoo - get some patience, learn what a first world problem is, and consider putting the money in a 529 plan instead" .
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    daewoo said:
    People getting gifts last minute will always need a brick and mortar store - up until we perfect teleportation.
    Most people would just prefer a gift card anyway - that way, they can get what they REALLY want.

    And with Amazon, you can get them one and email them the info without ever getting off your chair (:
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    alaskaguy said:
    Most people would just prefer a gift card anyway - that way, they can get what they REALLY want.

    For the type of people that lego would be bought for as presents (that is, kids and probably skewed towards younger kids), I don't think that is true. Gift vouchers for that age group are boring, despite being able to purchase whatever they want.
    stluxSprinkleOtter
  • MaffyDMaffyD Member Posts: 3,500
    Impulse buys are one thing, but there's only so much research you can do online before needing to actually look at a thing before buying it.
    For us AFOLs it's relatively easy to judge a set based on piece count, price, theme and an image of the box+built model. For children wanting a birthday present, or grandparent looking for one it might not be quite so easy, especially if Lego is not the only option - my son likes Lego a lot, but also likes Hot Wheels, action figures, console games, puzzles etc.
    B&M stores are really useful in this regard as you can see where your money goes. After that you might say "OK, we're having this set - let me search for it on Amazon" and there is even an image search in the app for just this scenario, but without the physical store you could be guessing at the value of a toy.
    BumblepantsFizyxgmonkey76
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    edited March 2018
    There will always be a need for a local shop where a consumer can touch and handle the product.

    (Just not one that has a $5B debtload as a result of 15+ years of mediocre to bad corporate management.)
    Bumblepantsdmcc0Fizyxgmonkey76Mr_CrossSprinkleOtter
  • daewoodaewoo Member Posts: 795
    alaskaguy said:
    daewoo said:
    People getting gifts last minute will always need a brick and mortar store - up until we perfect teleportation.
    Most people would just prefer a gift card anyway - that way, they can get what they REALLY want.

    And with Amazon, you can get them one and email them the info without ever getting off your chair (:
    Do you have kids?  I have four and gift cards were NOT wanted when they were younger (less than 10).  Now that they are older, certain gift cards are OK, but certainly not preferred to getting something that they like.
    eggshenSumoLegoFizyxstluxgmonkey76Mr_CrossSprinkleOtter
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    daewoo said:
    Do you have kids?  I have four and gift cards were NOT wanted when they were younger (less than 10).
    It's amazing how quickly that changes.  My nine year-old hated gift cards, as a mature ten year-old, it's all he wants.
    FizyxMuftak1Jern92Mr_CrossSprinkleOtter
  • FizyxFizyx Member Posts: 1,332
    edited March 2018
    SumoLego said:
    daewoo said:
    Do you have kids?  I have four and gift cards were NOT wanted when they were younger (less than 10).
    It's amazing how quickly that changes.  My nine year-old hated gift cards, as a mature ten year-old, it's all he wants.

    I know that a lot of people say they only want giftcards (mid to older kids included), but I think for most of them, if you could get them something they really wanted, ie something they would have purchased with that gift card anyway, then they would rather have that.  There's a lot of intangibles around receiving a great gift that you just can't get out of getting a gift card I think.

    Of course, as a mature 10 year-old, I'm sure that your kid would never admit to something so uncool :P
    SumoLegostluxdatsunrobbieSprinkleOtter
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    For those of us that are very price-conscious I can often give LEGO-related gifts with far higher RRP than I would give as a gift card.
    Fizyx said:
    Of course, as a mature 10 year-old, I'm sure that your kid would never admit to something so uncool :P
    Yeah, he's too busy trying to figure out how to get a Tesla, be a YouTube star, become the Black Panther, and start a clothing line with the Rock.

    (Assuming those things are still cool, or are cool or were cool.)
    FizyxstluxMuftak1davetheoxygenmanMr_CrossSprinkleOtter
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    Fizyx said:

    I know that a lot of people say they only want giftcards (mid to older kids included), but I think for most of them, if you could get them something they really wanted, ie something they would have purchased with that gift card anyway, then they would rather have that.  There's a lot of intangibles around receiving a great gift that you just can't get out of getting a gift card I think.

    Yes, giving a gift shows you know something about the person the gift is for, whereas a giftcard is a statement saying I don't know much about you except that you shop at X, or in some cases I know nothing about you but I assume that you shop at X. It is also nice to know someone uses / plays with something you bought them, whereas with a gift card often you don't ever find out what you bought them.

    I've never really understood the point of a gift card, you might as well just give cash if you cannot think of a gift.
    FizyxdatsunrobbieJern92SprinkleOtter
  • 560Heliport560Heliport Member Posts: 3,732
    A LEGO gift card (for instance) says, "I would have bought you a LEGO set, but I don't know which ones you already have, so pick what you want!" So a gift card can be more thoughtful than just cash. As a child, I would rather have received a gift than money which, eventually, I could go to a store to spend.   
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    daewoo said:
    Do you have kids?
    Why yes. It's the only reason I am buying Legos.
  • ShibShib Member Posts: 5,460
    CCC said:

    I've never really understood the point of a gift card, you might as well just give cash if you cannot think of a gift.
    I was always of the same mind but this years money has been quite tight for me but I still want to be able to get a lot of the Harry Potter LEGO when it comes out. As a result any time anyone has asked about birthday presents etc I’ve said gift cards, because I know full well if they were to give me cash it would be absorbed by other costs. At least LEGO shop gift cards will always be used on LEGO.
    BumblepantsstluxFizyxdmcc0Jern92Mr_Cross
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    Shib said:
    CCC said:

    I've never really understood the point of a gift card, you might as well just give cash if you cannot think of a gift.
    I was always of the same mind but this years money has been quite tight for me but I still want to be able to get a lot of the Harry Potter LEGO when it comes out. As a result any time anyone has asked about birthday presents etc I’ve said gift cards, because I know full well if they were to give me cash it would be absorbed by other costs. At least LEGO shop gift cards will always be used on LEGO.
    In cases like that it is more acceptable, as it is what you have asked for rather than lack of thought.
    stluxFizyxdmcc0
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    I guess I have a very different take on what a gift should be.

    I DON'T think a gift should be any of "it's what you asked for" kind of thing.  For example, "what do you want for your birthday?", "I want X", "Happy Birthday, I got you X".  I mean - that's just LAME. Besides being lazy on the part of the giver, it smacks of entitlement on the part of the recipient - IMHO.  I think the whole concept of maintaining and providing someone with a list of things you want, or a list of things to choose from, when giving them a gift is utterly ridiculous.

    I think a gift should be more of a symbolic representation of the relationship you have with the person.  Finding a suitable gift should be an exercise in thoughtfulness - expressing your knowledge and understanding of the recipient.  You shouldn't ASK them what they "want".  You should give them something that you think they will want or what you think they can use (even if they don't realize they want/need it) - based on your understanding of that person. It should be more personal. Sometimes you will get it wrong. Sometimes you may get it right - and when you do, it's a way more satisfying event than just giving someone something that was asked for. In short, I'd sum it up this way:

    • If you want X, then go buy yourself X
    • If you can't put some thought into it, no need to get me a gift - but thanks anyway
    • If you don't have much of a personal relationship with someone, then by all means, give a gift card, since it is just a "transaction" at that point anyway
    FWIW, I agree with you about gift cards. Nothing says, "I'm lazy" or "I'm giving you something basically just because I'm expected to" more than giving a gift card (or cash) as a gift.  There are some practical reasons that are possibly exceptions. One is a case of where shipping would be involved. If you're living in Alaska and you want to give a gift to someone in Virginia - you can easily blow a lot of "gift money" just on shipping it down there, if you're talking about buying locally, boxing it up and putting it in the mail (or UPS, or FedEx or whatever).   Alternatively, you can order something on-line and have it sent to the recipient - and maybe pay less in shipping, or no shipping at all....but then you have the issue of maybe not having the best address to ship to, or maybe receiving packages is inconvenient (stuff that has to be signed for, or sent to a communal address, etc.). All-in-all, a gift card to Amazon (or wherever) can be a perfectly reasonable option.
  • Muftak1Muftak1 Member Posts: 547
    ^ As my wife isn't up to date with the sets I have, she asks me to give her a list of sets I'd like for birthday/Christmas/anniversary/etc.

    So she literally asks me "What do you want?"
    davetheoxygenmanJern92
  • pharmjodpharmjod Member Posts: 2,916
    Lepin.




    Just trying to bring this thread back from the brink.
    SumoLegoFizyxwillobee498zmarkellaMaffyDSprinkleOtter
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    To be fair, just about everything relating to clone, fake and impostor bricks has been covered atleast three times.

    I'm sure the Forum Police will be stopping by to break up any off-topic fun.
    Muftak1Fizyxeggshendmcc0VorpalRyuAndyPolSprinkleOtter
  • VorpalRyuVorpalRyu Member Posts: 2,318
    ^ The Forum Police? What do you think this is....EuroBricks? :)
    SumoLegoxiahnaGremerBaby_YodaMr_CrossDoctorMcGannSprinkleOtter
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    Let's get it back on track ...

    Anyone want some counterfeit aliexpress gift cards for spending on Lepin and POGO?

    dmcc0BumblepantsAndyPolSprinkleOtter
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    Muftak1 said:
    So she literally asks me "What do you want?"
    And you don't answer "sex" ???
    Muftak1
  • monkeyhangermonkeyhanger Member Posts: 3,161
    CCC said:
    Let's get it back on track ...

    Anyone want some counterfeit aliexpress gift cards for spending on Lepin and POGO?

    Is that "Poonds", "Dullars" or "Eros" denominations?
    ShibBumblepantsgmonkey76Muftak1VorpalRyuSprinkleOtter
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    alaskaguy said:
    Muftak1 said:
    So she literally asks me "What do you want?"
    And you don't answer "sex" ???
    @alaskaguy misheard you... 'sets'.  You said 'sets'.
    VorpalRyuBaby_Yoda
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    monkeyhanger said:
    CCC said:
    Anyone want some counterfeit aliexpress gift cards for spending on Lepin and POGO?
    Is that "Poonds", "Dullars" or "Eros" denominations?
    Dnllnrs.  Good ol' American Dnllnrs.
    Muftak1FizyxVorpalRyugmonkey76Baby_YodaSprinkleOtter
  • MaffyDMaffyD Member Posts: 3,500
    SumoLego said:
    alaskaguy said:
    Muftak1 said:
    So she literally asks me "What do you want?"
    And you don't answer "sex" ???
    @alaskaguy misheard you... 'sets'.  You said 'sets'.
    Yeah, that either word can be really embarrassing to say by accident. Nearly got thrown out of the Lego shop that one time. And really dampened my wife's enthusiasm on another occasion. :-)
    Muftak1
  • SumoLegoSumoLego Member Posts: 15,217
    Well, that's the real reason why there are no religious LEGO.

    Nobody wants the confusion of asking for a sexy sect set.
    MaffyD560HeliportBaby_YodaSprinkleOtter
  • alaskaguyalaskaguy Member Posts: 335
    SumoLego said:
    Well, that's the real reason why there are no religious LEGO.

    Nobody wants the confusion of asking for a sexy sect set.
    Yeah - Scientology would never license it.
    Baby_Yoda
  • CCCCCC Member Posts: 20,526
    edited May 2018
    LEGO seem to be getting left behind compared to some of the cloners / fakers when it comes to bigfigs these days ...
     



  • pharmjodpharmjod Member Posts: 2,916
    Juggernaut looks great. Groot is a little too buff in the chest, but I like that scale.
  • PapaBearPapaBear Member Posts: 632
    I bet the counterfeit roller coasters suck.  I got a fake Emerald Night and the thing runs like complete sheit.
  • willobee498willobee498 Member Posts: 349
    I don't have one myself, but didn't the Lego Emerald Night have some issues on tracks too?
    gmonkey76
  • Baby_YodaBaby_Yoda Member Posts: 1,295
    Funny story, my uncle got a counterfeit UCS Y-wing about a month before the new one was announced. He must have got it damn cheap, too, because I had to jog his memory when I mentioned it.
  • zmarkellazmarkella Member Posts: 48
    PapaBear said:
    I bet the counterfeit roller coasters suck.  I got a fake Emerald Night and the thing runs like complete sheit.
    The knock-off Joker Manor one works fine.

    Also, the Bugatti Chiron copy is already up for pre-order. With pictures. Before the official Lego release.
  • PapaBearPapaBear Member Posts: 632
    willobee498 said:
    I don't have one myself, but didn't the Lego Emerald Night have some issues on tracks too?
    I guess it did.  I'll see if I can fix it sometime in the future with some recommendations I read, but iirc it borderline didn't work at all.
  • LyichirLyichir Member Posts: 1,009
    CCC said:
    LEGO seem to be getting left behind compared to some of the cloners / fakers when it comes to bigfigs these days ...
     



    It'd be hard for them not to—unless they were individually sold like these, it'd be pretty hard for Lego to release many more bigfigs than they do given that only a certain percentage of sets are even really big enough to merit their inclusion. Add in the fact that so much of their output has to be focused on current movies and there's not much opportunity to release this many comics-based bigfig characters.
    MAGNINOMINISUMBRA
  • Baby_YodaBaby_Yoda Member Posts: 1,295
    It's ironic how not having the license gives clone brands more freedom as to what they can do with it.
    Fizyx
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