Ebay question...Buyer wants the set shipped to a different address

wagnerml2

I am an experienced Ebayer, but I have my first questionable buyer in 1100 transactions. I sold a used Venator on Sunday night. Buyer paid immediately via paypal. Buyer then sent me a message via Ebay asking that the item be shipped to a different address with a different name (but in the same City). Reason cited that it is a present for the son and that they don't want him to see it. I am uncomfortable shipping to a different address that is verified with Ebay and Paypal.

I have sent a message saying that I can only ship to the verified address. Am I too worried about nothing? Any input is welcome.

graphite

^ I wouldn't call it worrying. It is just covering yourself as a seller. If they don't like it tell them you'll refund and they can pay again when they have the shipping address added and verified on paypal.

dougts

I have done this once or twice. I look heavily at the buyer's feedback and then make a gut decision based on that, the communications that occurred, and the value of the item.

graphite

^ I do the same for Bricklink sales, but ebay to me just seems to be a scammers market so personally I treat it differently. I've shipped parts orders directly to the buyers customer in a few cases when they were missing parts orders. If a high feedback store asks me I am willing to accommodate but lower feedback (even if all positive) with only buyer feedback I usually wouldn't.

LegoFanTexas

graphite said:

^ I wouldn't call it worrying. It is just covering yourself as a seller. If they don't like it tell them you'll refund and they can pay again when they have the shipping address added and verified on paypal.

^ This...

I've had several people in Canada ask if I can ship to their friend in NY or some place just across the border.

Sure, just as soon as you add the address to PayPal so I can ship to the "verified" address.

Most of the time, they do and it works just fine. If they don't, then no deal.

If you ship anywhere else and they complain, automatic refund to them. What do you have to gain by doing it?

Refund, let them fix their address, then have them repay. It isn't hard to add another address to a PayPal account.

vitreolum

This sounds really paranoid to me... There's several reasons for buyers to ask to ship to a different address (work address, cheaper shipping costs, gift, etc.), I really don't see what so dubious about it. Did any of you have any problems/more problems than shipping to verified address doing this, or was it a no go from the start?

Basta

There is nothing dubious about it, it's just that from my understanding you are not covered by PayPal seller protection if you do not send to the address given in PayPal.

meiklelewis

Just make sure the address is on the paypal payment, I had a buyer who did the same and emailed me his mates address on email he received goods and signed for the item at the address. Then turned around and said he didn't recieve it and knew nothing about the other address. PayPal gave him his money back straight away because it states in there terms the address must be on payment.
Turns out he was a scammer and had done this many many times.

vitreolum

^ And wasn't that reflected in his feedback somehow?

TheCableGuy

^ not necessarily as you can not leave neutral or negative feedback for a buyer.

If you leave a negative comment with a positive rating then the buyer can have it removed by ebay.

The only way is to leave a follow up comment to the initial one and not everyone knows about that so his actions as a buyer could quite well be hidden.

LegoFanTexas

vitreolum said:

This sounds really paranoid to me...

It does, until you're out $100 because it happens to you, then you'll see it another way. :)

LegoFanTexas

vitreolum said:

^ And wasn't that reflected in his feedback somehow?

You can't leave buyers negative feedback.

Buyers also can have 20 buyer accounts, they can also get positive feedback with negative comments removed.

TheCableGuy

^ ninja'd!

vitreolum

Just realized this was ebay related, not very familiar with that as I don't sell there much unless I want to get rid of something.

CCC

Ship it in a box with "Fragile: Plants" or something similar on it. Something uninteresting to kids. The kid shouldn't be opening his parent's mail anyway.

LegoFanTexas

vitreolum said:

Just realized this was ebay related, not very familiar with that as I don't sell there much unless I want to get rid of something.

Keep in mind that this is PayPal, not just eBay. So if you take PayPal for something sold on Bricklink, same rules apply.

stevemack

Its not worth the risk, you'd lose any paypal claim straight away on the basis u broke the rules for seller protection!
Just let them know you'll plainly package it etc and that paypal rules say you cant ship to any other address etc, that's what i do!

vitreolum

^^ Yes, but with bricklink you can check the buyers feedback properly. I've sent orders over $500 to unconfirmed addresses and never had a problem... but as you say, if I get burnt once or twice, I'll probably see things differently.

Steve_J_OM

As a buyer I once asked a BL seller to ship to a different address because the set I was ordering was a present for someone in the household, and they declined. I had never thought about it being a potential scamming avenue for buyers, but it made sense when they explained it to me. I didn't take offense either, it's perfectly normal for sellers to cover themselves first and foremost.

TheLoneTensor

graphite said:

^ I wouldn't call it worrying. It is just covering yourself as a seller. If they don't like it tell them you'll refund and they can pay again when they have the shipping address added and verified on paypal.

This, along with the fact of no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no don't ever send to anywhere but verified addresses...

dougts said:

I have done this once or twice. I look heavily at the buyer's feedback and then make a gut decision based on that, the communications that occurred, and the value of the item.

...unless maybe this, and you also have a dialogue with the person and basically trust them.

Bottom line for me is that anything over $100 I'm very careful. Anything over $200, if it's not verified, I will never send, ever.

madforLEGO

Agreed with others above. Get them to change the verified address to that address then.
I have found if they are not a scammer then they should probably have no issue updating their verified address, or just accept that they have to receive it at the address already present with paypal.
Most times I have heard this from a buyer, I have always had no issue telling them that the address has to be paypal verified and when I say they they usually understand and switch it.

If they are a scammer then they will probably protest a bit too much on that.

doriansdad

Never ever send an item sold on ebay or where you have accepted payment thru paypal to anything other than their paypal confirmed address. As others have said refund the buyer and then have them update their address and have them pay you again. You should list explicitly in your ebay listing you will only send to the buyer's paypal confirmed address - no exceptions.

It is not just getting scammed out of $100 you need to be concerned about. Ebay is sytematically banning small sellers from their site. The lowest rated 15k sellers every 3 months are getting banned as they focus on diamond sellers (big box retail, chinese exporters and the hi volume crowd). Be polite to the buyer and hopefully they won't ding your DSRs....if you do get knocked down to 4.8 in any category start a new seller account immediately. The bans are permanent without recourse for your entire household.

TheLoneTensor

Yes, be polite, because your absolute best tool in dealing with buyers is communication. Always send an invoice and be courteous whenever dealing with them, even if especially if they are being a jerk or contesting something you did.

One of the (oh, so many) BS things about ebay is that you cannot even see the detailed seller ratings details for any category, much less do anything about it. So for example, if you don't ship fast enough for a buyer, they can ding you and you will have no idea who did it or why - and it's permanent. More than that, even if you did somehow find out, it is against Ebay policy to contact buyers about it in any way shape or form.

Anyway, like @doriansdad mentioned above, state your terms - all of them, state them explicitly, state them clearly and state them in every single auction/BIN you post.

madforLEGO

Feedback ratings are ones opinion being put on a scale that cannot be reversed.
At least a Feedback you can respond too, or if it is completely off base(and you can prove that), go to eBay have have it yanked.
But with seller feedback ratings, someone can be a complete ass and put 1s across the board because they felt like it.
Now there are ways to stop some of this.
(send within 24 hours of getting paid, and freeshipping to give you automatic 5 stars on those listings) but the whole communications and was the item described properly all rely on a buyer not to be an ass IMO.
Actually I think the communications one you can get a 5 stars if you send them updates via eBay messaging (not sure if this includes automatic notices of shipment)

doriansdad

madforLEGO said:

Actually I think the communications one you can get a 5 stars if you send them updates via eBay messaging (not sure if this includes automatic notices of shipment)

No. You will get an automatic 5 for communication if you do NOT contact your buyer. Never ever message them. Once you message them they can then leave a rating.

madforLEGO

doriansdad said:

madforLEGO said:

Actually I think the communications one you can get a 5 stars if you send them updates via eBay messaging (not sure if this includes automatic notices of shipment)

No. You will get an automatic 5 for communication if you do NOT contact your buyer. Never ever message them. Once you message them they can then leave a rating.

Ah, Ok. seems a bit strange, but then again it IS eBay...
Thanks

dougts

no stranger than using calculated shipping with no handling charge and then getting low marks for shipping cost. I've long said that when using calculated shipping, the buyer should not be able to mark you down for the cost.

doriansdad

Buyers on ebay won't be happy unless shipping is free and they receive the item 3 days before they order it....good times :)

LegoFanTexas

doriansdad said:

Buyers on ebay won't be happy unless shipping is free and they receive the item 3 days before they order it....good times :)

^ Yep, this... times 10...

Buyers expect free shipping, that is just how it goes. Don't offer free shipping and buyers get cranky. :)

wagnerml2

Hey all,

Thanks for the input. Buyer got back to me and updated her shipping info. She had not had many feedbacks (8 total in the last 5 years) so I am comfortable now. Kinda odd that I've shipped as many as I have and this is the first time I've had this request.

y2josh

LegoFanTexas said:

doriansdad said:

Buyers on ebay won't be happy unless shipping is free and they receive the item 3 days before they order it....good times :)

^ Yep, this... times 10...

Buyers expect free shipping, that is just how it goes. Don't offer free shipping and buyers get cranky. :)

I haven't had any buyers directly complain about shipping, but that IS the only category I have a 4.9 in, so while I don't think all buyers are unreasonable, it certainly seems some are, though I honestly don't remember it being an issue in the pre-"wish we were Amazon" phase of the site.

Cam_n_Stu

y2josh said:

...I honestly don't remember it being an issue in the pre-"wish we were Amazon" phase of the site.

Very true, it is no longer a good marketplace (pun intended) for individuals or small scale sellers. It is now trying very hard to be the leading online marketplace for new goods from traditional retailers, as are Amazon for that matter. It is only the ubiquity of the site and corresponding traffic levels that keep it relevant for used items and small scale sellers. The sooner a well funded and trafficked competing offering arrives from one the mega-sites the better. Come on already Google, facebook, et al!

+1 on not shipping to unverified addresses. While there are plenty of legitimate justifications, it is also classic hacked buyer account behavior. Wouldn't take the risk.

madforLEGO

wagnerml2 said:

Hey all,

Thanks for the input. Buyer got back to me and updated her shipping info. She had not had many feedbacks (8 total in the last 5 years) so I am comfortable now. Kinda odd that I've shipped as many as I have and this is the first time I've had this request.

Cool, glad it is worked out!